Turbo'd 8 Rich as Piss
10-22-2005, 06:13 PM
#1
Turbo'd 8 Rich as ****
hey every1. Just took the car around the block for the first time and it's running rich as hell! I think it's becuase of my ecu r flash, and the emanage was made for an m flash. Anyway, any suggestions for leaning this bastard out before i can get it to the shop, cus i'm afraid to run it much if its this rich. Is there anyway to get the emanage software w/o paying $130 so i can lean it out a little b4 i can get it tuned? All input helps, and if sum1 wants to hook me up with the emanage software that would help alot more!
10-22-2005, 07:33 PM
#5
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Congrats on getting it up and running. what are your AFRs? There really is no harm in running it too rich. You might get a missfire before you warm up, but that won't hurt.
10-22-2005, 08:24 PM
#6
lol, i get backfires like you wouldnt believe. it's crazy. i havent checked the afr yet. i would like to get the emanage software to lean it out a lil but i dont have it nor the cable that is needed. i think it's just sum kinda funky usb cable though. i'd feel alot better if i could lean it out sum though so i could feel better about driving it more.
10-22-2005, 08:33 PM
#7
Ex- member.
Check this thread if you haven't already. It just shows how much hp I was losing in the topend from it being too rich. That was with the stock Greddy map and the m flash.
They took out lots of fuel to get the AFR's to 11.5-11.8, the hp increase was very noticeable.
Took my car in for the heat recall and hoped there wasn't any fuel changes going from M flash to R flash, BUT there was. So my car is pig rich again, around 10.0 and 9's sometimes.
Of course this is with my leaner, tuned map. I can only imagine how RICH you are since your on the stock Greddy map AND on the R flash.
Even if you do get it tuned, there's some talk of the stock computer changing the fuel trim over time. No definite proof for sure yet, but I'm going with the interceptor anyways.
I suggest finding a shop that has experience with the emanage and they should have the support tool/software to tune it. It'll definitely run much better than it does now.
Or you can buy the support tool/software and try leaning it out some or getting a map from someone else. My tuned map is in that thread I linked. I'm not sure if anyone has tuned it yet for the R flash, most are staying with the M flash so far.
I'll update on how the interceptor X does when I get it next week.
They took out lots of fuel to get the AFR's to 11.5-11.8, the hp increase was very noticeable.
Took my car in for the heat recall and hoped there wasn't any fuel changes going from M flash to R flash, BUT there was. So my car is pig rich again, around 10.0 and 9's sometimes.
Of course this is with my leaner, tuned map. I can only imagine how RICH you are since your on the stock Greddy map AND on the R flash.
Even if you do get it tuned, there's some talk of the stock computer changing the fuel trim over time. No definite proof for sure yet, but I'm going with the interceptor anyways.
I suggest finding a shop that has experience with the emanage and they should have the support tool/software to tune it. It'll definitely run much better than it does now.
Or you can buy the support tool/software and try leaning it out some or getting a map from someone else. My tuned map is in that thread I linked. I'm not sure if anyone has tuned it yet for the R flash, most are staying with the M flash so far.
I'll update on how the interceptor X does when I get it next week.
10-22-2005, 08:40 PM
#8
o yea, way too rich! I'm upset to cus i was on m until like a month ago when i took it in for the gas tank recall. pisses me off, lol. I wonder if mazda can reflash it back to m for me to lean it out sum. is that a possibility? cus if ur running sumtimes 9's and urs is a leaner map, i seriously wouldnt doubt if im conisitantly there and maybe even in the 8's! As far as the shops go, none that i know of around here have any e-manage experience, so i'm kinda skeptical about taking it to any of the shops i know. There might be a guy in Greensboro though, and thas only about 20 minutes from where i live so i'll have to check him out. I'll look into ur map for now, thanks.
10-22-2005, 09:33 PM
#9
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Unfortunately, you can't go back on flashes, I looked into it when I first intalled my Greddy kit, I wanted to go back from N to M. But the software will only update the ecu if there is a newer version.
10-22-2005, 11:25 PM
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They haven't even started working on it. I wouldn't hold my breath. If you didn't install an AFR gage, you really can't tune it yourself. So, you might just have to find a shop to get the tune done. Or spend the $ for a gage and the software +cable.
.
10-23-2005, 06:33 PM
#20
i don't know what it is, i don't have that gauge. It just smells rich and backfires alot, and it probably should be rich considering greddy's map is quite rich. I'm going to get it tuned very soon so am just hardly driving the car, and when it goes to the shop we will look at all of those numbers. If i had to guess its probably around 9, but thats just an estimate cus im using the richer r flash as well.
10-24-2005, 12:36 PM
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Originally Posted by zoom44
the R flash is not richer than the M or N or P.
Here is an over-simplified way I thought about it. Consider the RPM range where the use of the P1 and P2 injectors overlap. If at one RPM value in that range, the R flash reduced the use of the P2's say by 50%, but increased the use of the P1's by 30%, then the net reduction would be 20% on a stock 8. On the GReddy setup, the effect would be to keep the P2 injection the same as it always was specified on the sub injector map, while increasing the P1 injection by some amount specified in the additional injection map, say by +30% of the ECU's pulse. So a GReddy 8 would have a 1.3*1.3=1.69, or a 69% increase in fuel delivery for that particular cell in the map. So if the target AFR was already 10.5 for the GReddy, you can see why it would run so much richer - 69% more fuel! This over-simplification shows how a stocker could run leaner with the R, while the GReddy 8's run richer.
ITs probably that the R flash uses the injectors in different proportions than the M flash did.
Hows that for an explanation!
10-24-2005, 01:22 PM
#23
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Originally Posted by MadDog
The consensus is that the GReddy turbo maps run richer on the R flash than the M flash. This is true eventhough the overall AFRs from a stock car running the R flash might be leaner than a stock car running the M flash. The reason is probably due to the way a stock car uses the Primary1, Primary2, and secondary injectors, versus the way the GReddy setup does. The GReddy setup takes complete control of the P2 injectors and specifies the duty cycle for them in the "sub injector" map. It adds a percentage of the injector pulse to the P1's and secondaries as specified in the "additional injection" map.
Here is an over-simplified way I thought about it. Consider the RPM range where the use of the P1 and P2 injectors overlap. If at one RPM value in that range, the R flash reduced the use of the P2's say by 50%, but increased the use of the P1's by 30%, then the net reduction would be 20% on a stock 8. On the GReddy setup, the effect would be to keep the P2 injection the same as it always was specified on the sub injector map, while increasing the P1 injection by some amount specified in the additional injection map, say by +30% of the ECU's pulse. So a GReddy 8 would have a 1.3*1.3=1.69, or a 69% increase in fuel delivery for that particular cell in the map. So if the target AFR was already 10.5 for the GReddy, you can see why it would run so much richer - 69% more fuel! This over-simplification shows how a stocker could run leaner with the R, while the GReddy 8's run richer.
ITs probably that the R flash uses the injectors in different proportions than the M flash did.
Hows that for an explanation!
Here is an over-simplified way I thought about it. Consider the RPM range where the use of the P1 and P2 injectors overlap. If at one RPM value in that range, the R flash reduced the use of the P2's say by 50%, but increased the use of the P1's by 30%, then the net reduction would be 20% on a stock 8. On the GReddy setup, the effect would be to keep the P2 injection the same as it always was specified on the sub injector map, while increasing the P1 injection by some amount specified in the additional injection map, say by +30% of the ECU's pulse. So a GReddy 8 would have a 1.3*1.3=1.69, or a 69% increase in fuel delivery for that particular cell in the map. So if the target AFR was already 10.5 for the GReddy, you can see why it would run so much richer - 69% more fuel! This over-simplification shows how a stocker could run leaner with the R, while the GReddy 8's run richer.
ITs probably that the R flash uses the injectors in different proportions than the M flash did.
Hows that for an explanation!
I ditto the utter crappiness of the R flash w/eManage + GReddy.