9krpmrx8

iTrader: (46)

Typically I let my coolant get 150F at least before leaving but now that I am seeing my oil temps I will wait until my oil temps are at 120 or so before driving anywhere(pain in the *** but necessary). I am also considering getting a remote start device put in. It's too much of a pain to cruise through my neighborhood so i will risk the rich condition at idle. I will just make sure I hit the highways long on ramp aggressively

ASH8

Flash it was Ayrton who showed a German Mazda paper mentioning a 90 or 95C OC T Stat???...seems very Hot to open to me??, I know the FC one says 60C, which seems more appropriate (perhaps the Germans have Different Oil Coolers...but I doubt that)...90-95C just seems way too high...IMO

Paul, when I physically touch the outside of my oil coolers (both) from a stone cold Motor (in Winter), I touched all of the area top to bottom/sides and it is definitely heating up immediately...I don't know how it would By Pass the "main" cooling section when there is heat forming all over the Oil Cooler, remember 09's you can physically see/touch almost 100% of the front of the Cooler....

Perhaps the thermostat is just restricting FULL oil flow,...it must as otherwise I would feel no heat, I can warm car for 5 minutes and they are getting HOT to touch...it would have to by pass some oil as with the 09's all the Oil goes into the coolers first from Pump, then Oil Filter, then it is split to external OCV and to Rear oil intake (for E-shaft).
S1 and previous rotaries go, Pump, Oil Cooler(s), then Via Rear By Pass Valve into Oil Filter, E-shaft, Turbo (if fitted) then MOP.

Same applies it must just restrict Oil Flow, until IMO 60C then OC TS is fully Open??

OD..., both my cooler "feel" the same temps...
Phillip...,the heat is felt on both sides (where the OC Pipe Returns Go) Top and Bottom evenly.

IMO, I believe the TS restrict the flow, then Open once Oil reaches set temp for Full Flow, there is a By Pass Passage (as Mazda calls it) also in the OC.

ASH8

Yep, where the Two Banjos Bolt on Inlet and return..

It was Paul (Mazmart) who cut open the Small Oblong Hose Fixing Block to reveal the T Stat, or was it just a Relief Valve, looks like they are a Heat Pellet from Paul's pics.

My TS Blocks look more square with straight edges?

RX-8 Parts Pic of OC...see red circle..

ASH8

These are what Paul had done...
Some are FC and other I think were RX-8?..

madcows

Hey! That's what I tried to remove in order to drain the oil coolers - but it wouldn't budge.

It does look like most of the oil would still flow through the coolers though, as that piece looks like it could only by-pass a little bit. It might even be there just to ease the flow of oil through the coolers when cold. Hmm.

ASH8

9K!!!..if you are interested...

Just got back from this morning drive...
Into the city....on expressway...not stopping for 40 KMS (24 miles) at 100 KMH (60MPH)...outside Temp was 26C (79F) (morning), Coolant temps stayed between 82C (180F) and 84C (183F) all the way...

Way home after a few Hours (Engine Still Warm), coming back, traffic and Stop lights, and Air ON, and no expressway...

Outside temp 36 C (97F)...

Coolant temps...between 86 and max 97 C (186F and 206F)..

Max was at Stop Lights, most of the time it was 86 to 92 (197F), with Air cond ON..sometimes down to 84C.

Engine Air Intake Temp ( I guess this is read from the MAF? on my OBD Reader) was 45C ( 113F)..

In an Hour or So our Max Day temp is said to reach 45C (113F), at the moment 40C (104F)..

Bloody HOT, and my car ain't going anywhere in this heat!!..;(
Tomorrow it is said to be only 25C ( 77F)...

9krpmrx8

iTrader: (46)

I did a little test on the way home and banged through some gears once the oil temp was up to 180F and I did manage to get the oil temp up to 197F but it was only about 60F outside.

ASH8

Only 60F...it is 110 F (43C) at my place in the SHADE right now, with a HOT Northerly Wind!!!....it is BOILING HOT!...and it is still Spring!, and getting hotter today!

Supposed to be a change later tonight with RAIN and 23C 73F tomorrow!

Breaking news...

We have a car rally here in Adelaide, it is called the Classic Adelaide Rally, world known, with Classic cars and drivers from all over the world.

There is an FD in the event!

They close off roads in our Hills Area, been going for about 12 years..
http://www.classicadelaide.com.au/ca09/index.asp

A Driver and his Co-Driver has just been killed during a stage...

ayrton012

Just for exact data, there is a 90C (194F) oil cooler thermostat.

I usually check the coolers by my hand too, and they only gets warm when my oil temp gauge shows around 170-175F. So it seems to me that the 194F data is right, because the gauge sensor gets the oil after the coolers cooled it.

ayrton012

I need the Mazmart REmedy (S1 Renesis) oil pressure kit.

ayrton012

Verifying the origin of the oil coolers thermostat data.

olddragger

iTrader: (3)

well to continue with the oil cooler thermostat exploration--this morning ambient was 43F (winter up here Ash!), oil cooler surface temps --both--were 43F per laser thermometer. Within 30 secs after starting they were up to 55F --actually the drivers side was 55---the passengers side was 53F. So oil flow is occuring in the coolers at cold start. Thermostat must not be working?
I still wonder if it is not a thermostat but a relief valve in case a cooler clogs?
A good thermostat would be a good thing to have.
But cold oil is flowing through the coolers.
OD

PhillipM

Makes you wonder if it's just a flow control thermostat - lower flow when cold, more when hot - rather than a proper shutoff - it it was a shutoff, it would make far more sense to have it engine-side.

9krpmrx8

iTrader: (46)

Well then I am glad I am going with a single cooler and a proper oil thermostat. After this weekend we will see how quickly my oil warms up.

olddragger

iTrader: (3)

in thinking through this some--dont we need to get the oil to 190-200F (oil not coolant now) to boil of the natural condensation we have in the sump pan on cold start up? Remember the milky white sustance on the oil check stick discussion?
Could this be a factor in the short drive is not good for this engine thoughts?
I understand that oil has to be gradually warmed---all of it---as you dont want cold oil shock to occur, so you have to have some flow all the time.
IMHO the present oil thermostat is not doing the job. I rarely see temps over 185F even during a 90+F day and especially during the cooler months. Cooler months I see more like 165--175 and I dont think that is hot enough to boil off the condensation?
UOA seems to be ok, but doesnt the oil need to be 180F to 200F range?
Earl's makes a nice remote oil thermostat with 3 tapped holes for sensors. With it --if you want too--you could measure temps going to the cooler and coming from the cooler.
Looks to me that 9K has a good idea with the single cooler and aftermarket thermostat?
ODl

ASH8

Well Mine Don't...I have an S2 remember..they are different OC by part number, I can't confirm the "Exact" changes between the two series.

Your information you posted was from a Mazda German paper..correct?..

Sorry I just do not believe the 90C thermostat....Not in S2 (my Car)..

IMO it would be 60-65C like the E-shaft Pellet.

I have said this before, they start to get hot ALL OVER within a minute, after 5 or less they are HOT..HOT..ALL Over...

IMO the OC Thermostat in S1 (maybe S2?) is a Restrictive one ONLY...

ASH8

Yes Phillip, possibly not a true Cut Off TS....

But, remember, In those pics above I think the two small 8 mm holes were drilled into the sides to show us the detail...pretty sure on that one..PAUL where are you..

ASH8

Your still in Autumn aren't you?...! ....sorry Fall...what's falling..."leaves"..lol..
Sorry..

I tend to agree, remember the S2 Oil Flow Diagram (do you want me to post again) shows there is a By Pass 'Relief' on the OC's, can't see why the S1 is any different.

9krpmrx8

iTrader: (46)

Okay I was stuck downtown in traffic today and with an outside temp of 75F my oil temp was at 200F while stuck in traffic and quickly cooled down to 180 after a minute or two on the freeway.

arghx7

For what's it worth, my oil temps were steady at about 150 F (65 C) on my non turbo FC unless it was hot outside. That's measured at an oil filter sandwich plate

madcows

Out of curiosity, what oil weight do you run in it?

GeorgeH

iTrader: (2)

The moisture will evaporate at lower temperatures, it will just take longer to do it. Take a hot cup of coffee outside on a cold day and what happens? It steams nicely, and it's at what - 120F?

Basically there is a relationship between the temp of the oil, the temp of the air, and the relative humidity that controls the evaoporation rate, if memory serves me correctly. I'm sure somebody else can add more detail, but the oil doesn't need to be at 190F before evaporation will begin. It just takes less time when it is that hot.

The milky white substance is interesting. I've been wondering if this has more to do with cavitation? Maybe in combination with moisture?

PhillipM

As George says, the evaporation of condensation is a squared function of the temperature differential, so whilst it is much faster when the oil is fully warmed up, even 170F will remove it given enough time.

The white substance will be emulsified oil/water from the moisture going through the water pump/stationary gears, or as you say, some slight cavitation.

9krpmrx8

iTrader: (46)

I am running 0W-30.

ayrton012

Yes I remember your S2... Maybe that has a different thermostat, as there are a lot of differences in the oil system S2 vs S1.

The information is in my European Service Book, i don't speak german, but i could not get the English version. Otherwise I'm registrated in the newest WEB Mazda Service Program (MESI), but there aren't any information about the coolers thermostat.

My oil coolers are always cold (by hand) if the oil temps (by my gauge) are below 158F. I think the thermostat are fully opened at 194F, but they start to open at lower temps (as usually every thermostat).

Strange that you feel them warm 1 min after cold start! S2 thing???