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Better gas mileage at higher rpms, true or not?

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Old 04-30-2005 | 03:54 AM
  #26  
fullsmoke's Avatar
Anatomy of a corner...
 
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From: CT
Originally Posted by MX6_2_RX8
Has everybody lost their minds? What does peak horsepower have to do with peak efficiency? Peak horsepower means that it can burn the MOST fuel and turn it into power. Frictional losses & heat losses go up with RPM. When fuel is ignited it does two main things, it makes the car move and it makes waste heat that needs to be dissipated by the radiator. For arguments sake lets say you are going 80mph in 3rd at 8000 RPM vs going 80mph in 6th at about 4000rpm. The speed is the same so the energy needed to move the car is the same. BUT at 8000 RPM you are heating up the combustion chamber twice as many times! There are of course dozens of other factors but that is probably one of the biggest. You could make the same argument with friction. The owner’s manual recommends shift points for cruising that are around 2700 RPM. I’d probably start looking for peak efficiency there.

Car salesmen don’t always know what they are talking about, plain and simple. I would also be careful about believing everything you read on this forum.

edit.. Forgot to mention the extra heat going out the exhaust. Duh.
Per unit gas, per unit power produced. Else why wouldn't every engine just dump in a bunch of extra fuel and air into every RPM (provided the engine wouldn't die out)?

FS
Old 04-30-2005 | 04:02 AM
  #27  
xxdevilzeroxx's Avatar
Revin 9500k
 
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From: Orange County
i played with the RPM's so much and Reving high doesnt save gas! belive me
Old 04-30-2005 | 04:43 AM
  #28  
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From: Nicosia, Cyprus
The simplest way to enjoy good milage out of the 8 is not to look at the fuel guage. As the old adage says "what the eye doesnt see the heart doesnt grieve about" Try too hard to squeeze more mpg and you just wasting the experience.

However on a more useful note, 4 things that have improved my mpg are:

1. don't drive too conservatively (trying too hard seems to make it worse) use 2nd and 3rd gears regularly keeping between 3500 - 4750 rpm, doesnt greatly effect mpg and does increase driving pleasure.

2. crisp efficent gear changes - dont depress the clutch all the way down and then ride it on the way back up whilst feeding the accelator, in an effort to keep the change smooth. Learn where it bites and dip in and out short, fast(er) but smoothly and you wont even notice the gear change. Over a tank of petrol you'll notice the difference once you've mastered efficient gear changes.

3. Euro unleaded 95 just doesnt work at all (splutters and falters at 6500 as the 3rd ports open and generally feels strained) and disapperas faster than a glass of good wine, and 100 seems more efficient than 98 (but mine is a type S JDM so that might be why it prefers 100 octane)

4. I used to have a normal 1.6si corolla and always used to floor it in every gear. Wide Open Throttle is very rarely necessary with the 8 from a bangs-for-your-bucks point of view. 60-75% open throttle makes a deal of difference to the mpg. Don't stomp on the accelarator pedal either feed in quick and smooth for better accelaration and mpg
Old 04-30-2005 | 07:28 AM
  #29  
MX6_2_RX8's Avatar
A nice step up!!!
 
Joined: Dec 2004
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From: Maine
Originally Posted by fullsmoke
Per unit gas, per unit power produced. Else why wouldn't every engine just dump in a bunch of extra fuel and air into every RPM (provided the engine wouldn't die out)?

FS
Because they can't get enough of the air and fuel into the right place at the right time, get it burned (efficiently), get it out of there and do it again in 1/9200th of a minute.

I think the best analogy would be to think of moving a stack of bricks from one pile to another. (Doing work)

Low RPM - You could do a lot of work with a little movement and move the whole pile at once but you wouldn't have enough power to do it. (lugging)

Optimum RPM - you could take a few at a time 5, 8, 10 whatever you were comfortable with based on your strength, build and other factors.

High RPM - You could take one at a time very quickly and easily but there would be so much other work going back and forth that that wouldn't be the best way.

I know I'll probably get flamed because it isn't a perfect analogy but I think it kind of gets the point across.

I think this horse is dead.
Old 04-30-2005 | 11:17 AM
  #30  
Overport's Avatar
Overport
 
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From: Florida
False! At higher RPM's you burn more fuel, faster.
Old 04-30-2005 | 03:40 PM
  #31  
SDB's Avatar
SDB
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From: Florida
Originally Posted by SDRacer87
False! At higher RPM's you burn more fuel, faster.
OK, but don't you go faster and farther which is the 'miles' part of miles per gallon.
Old 04-30-2005 | 06:59 PM
  #32  
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I tend to agree with Vip_C. We shouldn't even be having this conversation. Getting an RX-8 and then complaining about gas mileage is almost as absurd as getting an RX-8 and complaining that it doesn't handle well off-road. This is a SPORTSCAR, not a Prius!
Old 04-30-2005 | 07:35 PM
  #33  
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From: PA
Originally Posted by SDRacer87
False! At higher RPM's you burn more fuel, faster.
no, every engine has a peak efficiency range - search the term Brake Specific Fuel Consumption curve which graphs fuel/hp vs rpms... the lowest point on the curve is the best efficiency which is usually about 1/3 of redline in most engines

as I have proven in another thread, the best efficiency is 3200-3400 rpms, which coincidently corresponds to 6th gear at 65mph and 5th gear at 55mph
Old 04-30-2005 | 11:42 PM
  #34  
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From: So Cal
Sorry, but fuel is not potential energy (g*z). It is internal energy.
Old 05-01-2005 | 03:59 AM
  #35  
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From: Burnaby, BC
Originally Posted by Vip_C
What the f**k???

The 8 is a guzzler, get use to it!

I wouldn't drive mine like a pansy to get an extra 10/20 miles out of a full tank,

Drive it how you like..
my thoughts exactly...

peeps always poppin up threads to gain an extra mile... i dont know why?

everyone buys this car knowing very well about rotaries (especially the mileage, from the RX7)

its a sports car the last thing on your mind should have been mileage.. if you want a economical car go buy a toyota..

and dont bother getting technical on me because you get 16-17mpg when the sticker says 18mpg... i dont really care and those peeps need to lighten up and drive, appreciate the car for its HORRible mileage or simply get rid of it and buy a corolla!

Old 05-01-2005 | 10:15 AM
  #36  
BearTrap's Avatar
Rotary Junkie
 
Joined: Jul 2004
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From: San Antonio
Originally Posted by agoodcave
Sorry, but fuel is not potential energy (g*z). It is internal energy.
Sorry, but all energy is either potential energy or kinetic energy. Potential energy is stored energy. Liquid fuel is potential energy until something is done with it. If you ignite the vapors mixed with air, it combusts. If you drop a gallon of gas from 4 feet, it turns into kinetic energy (and a mess), but retains the potential energy to burn until it is evaporated and vapors are too lean to burn.
Old 05-01-2005 | 08:56 PM
  #37  
RX8Bliss's Avatar
donuts are day old bagels
 
Joined: Feb 2004
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From: Californication
I thought the second injectors open at 4250, and the third at 6000.
Oh, and I drive 3500~4500, I've never dipped lower than 18mpg.
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