Cumulative Synthetic Oil Discussion
#754
Super Moderator
Found this Interesting on the Pettit Racing website...
"We routinely receive Renesis engines that failed: some of the causes are listed below by order of popularity:
# 1 Turbo charged w/high backpressure ratio.
#2 Poor maintenance
#3 Overheated
#4 Hi mileage/excessive seal wear; regular use of Protek-R will greatly reduce the likelihood of this occurring.
#5 Bearing failure, the oil recommendation 5/20 seems to be inadequate, most Renesis engines opened have excessive bearing wear, we therefore recommend a quality 10/40 or 20/50 oil the latter for racing and spirited driving."
http://pettitracing.com/rx8/index_information.htm
My Edit #4. In other words Pre-Mixing.
"We routinely receive Renesis engines that failed: some of the causes are listed below by order of popularity:
# 1 Turbo charged w/high backpressure ratio.
#2 Poor maintenance
#3 Overheated
#4 Hi mileage/excessive seal wear; regular use of Protek-R will greatly reduce the likelihood of this occurring.
#5 Bearing failure, the oil recommendation 5/20 seems to be inadequate, most Renesis engines opened have excessive bearing wear, we therefore recommend a quality 10/40 or 20/50 oil the latter for racing and spirited driving."
http://pettitracing.com/rx8/index_information.htm
My Edit #4. In other words Pre-Mixing.
#755
Here in Belgium the dealers are using DEXELIA oils (from Shell or Total ) , if You want to utilise full-synthetic motor oil they advise to change the oil system :
instead of feeding the metering pump with engine oil , feed the metering pump from a separate tank with 2-stroke oil or Dexelia those are ment to be burned inside the engine , 4-stroke synthethic motor oil is 'nt made to be burned .
2-stroke or Dexelia are specialy composed to burn without leaving much residu (ashes , coal )
Advantage is also that in such a system with separate oiltank to feed the metering pump , your motor oil level should stay the same , as there is 'n t anymore oilconsumption to feed the metering pump .
instead of feeding the metering pump with engine oil , feed the metering pump from a separate tank with 2-stroke oil or Dexelia those are ment to be burned inside the engine , 4-stroke synthethic motor oil is 'nt made to be burned .
2-stroke or Dexelia are specialy composed to burn without leaving much residu (ashes , coal )
Advantage is also that in such a system with separate oiltank to feed the metering pump , your motor oil level should stay the same , as there is 'n t anymore oilconsumption to feed the metering pump .
Last edited by TurboBoost; 01-04-2009 at 01:25 PM.
#756
Registered User
start of 2009, oil changing places say you cant bring your own oil now, but now im in a little bit in a dead end here, i just went to 5 places and they say the same thing, i even called around, when i asked them if they have 20w50 oil , all of them say no, we dont carry that, i already went to pepboys and got 20w50 with k&n oil filter to, like a week ago, now i cant change my oil, and its low, will it be ok if i put in 20w50 oil in my car with old 5w20 gtx, im up to 2000 miles on my old oil, and im used to changing it 2k every other month
#757
Super Moderator
YES!, ![Wink](https://www.rx8club.com/images/smilies/wink.gif)
All modern oils mix, syth or dino, don't be so paranoid, it's not that hard to work out.
Just put it in a good quality oil range for the climate you live in...if you can't get 20W50 scale down to a supply you can get.
As said before you will still have a few litres left (old oil) in your oil coolers that can not be drained unless you pull the complete front bumper off, dismantle coolers ,etc,etc.
![Wink](https://www.rx8club.com/images/smilies/wink.gif)
All modern oils mix, syth or dino, don't be so paranoid, it's not that hard to work out.
Just put it in a good quality oil range for the climate you live in...if you can't get 20W50 scale down to a supply you can get.
As said before you will still have a few litres left (old oil) in your oil coolers that can not be drained unless you pull the complete front bumper off, dismantle coolers ,etc,etc.
#758
Registered User
YES!, ![Wink](https://www.rx8club.com/images/smilies/wink.gif)
All modern oils mix, syth or dino, don't be so paranoid, it's not that hard to work out.
Just put it in a good quality oil range for the climate you live in...if you can't get 20W50 scale down to a supply you can get.
As said before you will still have a few litres left (old oil) in your oil coolers that can not be drained unless you pull the complete front bumper off, dismantle coolers ,etc,etc.
![Wink](https://www.rx8club.com/images/smilies/wink.gif)
All modern oils mix, syth or dino, don't be so paranoid, it's not that hard to work out.
Just put it in a good quality oil range for the climate you live in...if you can't get 20W50 scale down to a supply you can get.
As said before you will still have a few litres left (old oil) in your oil coolers that can not be drained unless you pull the complete front bumper off, dismantle coolers ,etc,etc.
#759
Zoom-Freakin'-Zoom
iTrader: (5)
YES!, ![Wink](https://www.rx8club.com/images/smilies/wink.gif)
All modern oils mix, syth or dino, don't be so paranoid, it's not that hard to work out.
Just put it in a good quality oil range for the climate you live in...if you can't get 20W50 scale down to a supply you can get.
As said before you will still have a few litres left (old oil) in your oil coolers that can not be drained unless you pull the complete front bumper off, dismantle coolers ,etc,etc.
![Wink](https://www.rx8club.com/images/smilies/wink.gif)
All modern oils mix, syth or dino, don't be so paranoid, it's not that hard to work out.
Just put it in a good quality oil range for the climate you live in...if you can't get 20W50 scale down to a supply you can get.
As said before you will still have a few litres left (old oil) in your oil coolers that can not be drained unless you pull the complete front bumper off, dismantle coolers ,etc,etc.
https://www.rx8club.com/series-i-do-yourself-forum-73/diy-max-oil-out-oil-change-90879/
beers
![Beer](https://www.rx8club.com/images/smilies/beer.gif)
#760
Out of NYC
iTrader: (1)
10w based oil will not freeze up at 15f, since the pour point of 10w30 mineral based oil is something like -35f, and if its True Synthetic based (like IV OR V), pour point will be much better so nothing much to worry about
if u really worried, maybe start with something like 5w30 or 5w40.
it will work, oil mixes with each other.
Last edited by nycgps; 01-05-2009 at 11:47 AM.
#761
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Regarding Winter/Cold:
Is there an issue using 10w40 or 20w50 in the winter? I looked at the charts in the various threads, but it doesn't help unknowledgeable-me determine what is the highest I can go in New England winters? I am doing my own changes now, but the actual weight still has me a bit skittish, mainly due to the "unless you live in a cold climate" caveat that so many people mention![Smilie](https://www.rx8club.com/images/smilies/smile.gif)
Currently running 5w30 and PureOne filter
Is there an issue using 10w40 or 20w50 in the winter? I looked at the charts in the various threads, but it doesn't help unknowledgeable-me determine what is the highest I can go in New England winters? I am doing my own changes now, but the actual weight still has me a bit skittish, mainly due to the "unless you live in a cold climate" caveat that so many people mention
![Smilie](https://www.rx8club.com/images/smilies/smile.gif)
Currently running 5w30 and PureOne filter
#765
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If by this you are joking, ok ![Smilie](https://www.rx8club.com/images/smilies/smile.gif)
If you are serious or even half serious, you should know and understand that the 0 property is best when cold or when cold STARTING your engine, wether it is -20 degrees outside or 106.
As soon as that oil hits operating temperature, its the 40 number you should be looking at.
40 being far from water oil![Smilie](https://www.rx8club.com/images/smilies/smile.gif)
For this reason, IMO and I am sure others, 0w40 is a perfectly suitable oil for year long use in whatever climate you live in.
![Smilie](https://www.rx8club.com/images/smilies/smile.gif)
If you are serious or even half serious, you should know and understand that the 0 property is best when cold or when cold STARTING your engine, wether it is -20 degrees outside or 106.
As soon as that oil hits operating temperature, its the 40 number you should be looking at.
40 being far from water oil
![Smilie](https://www.rx8club.com/images/smilies/smile.gif)
For this reason, IMO and I am sure others, 0w40 is a perfectly suitable oil for year long use in whatever climate you live in.
#766
Out of NYC
iTrader: (1)
Regarding Winter/Cold:
Is there an issue using 10w40 or 20w50 in the winter? I looked at the charts in the various threads, but it doesn't help unknowledgeable-me determine what is the highest I can go in New England winters? I am doing my own changes now, but the actual weight still has me a bit skittish, mainly due to the "unless you live in a cold climate" caveat that so many people mention![Smilie](https://www.rx8club.com/images/smilies/smile.gif)
Currently running 5w30 and PureOne filter
Is there an issue using 10w40 or 20w50 in the winter? I looked at the charts in the various threads, but it doesn't help unknowledgeable-me determine what is the highest I can go in New England winters? I am doing my own changes now, but the actual weight still has me a bit skittish, mainly due to the "unless you live in a cold climate" caveat that so many people mention
![Smilie](https://www.rx8club.com/images/smilies/smile.gif)
Currently running 5w30 and PureOne filter
but if u change ur oil every say 3K miles or something u should be ok. dont forget every oil change u will change about 1/2 oil out only, even with swoope's max in out method, maybe 3/4 out.
that would work
...
#767
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[QUOTE=nycgps;2801308]because the wider the range is, the more additives it has, and those modifiers wears out over time. without those additives, the oil will be junk.
but if u change ur oil every say 3K miles or something u should be ok. dont forget every oil change u will change about 1/2 oil out only, even with swoope's max in out method, maybe 3/4 out./QUOTE]
I realize the VI argument is out there; but that is primarily applicable to mineral oil, and this is a discussion about synthetics. As I understand it, synthetics should not require much VI, though they probably will be needed for the carrier oil for their additives. Nonetheless, a wide range should be much less of an issue for synthetics than for mineral because of their base composition.
but if u change ur oil every say 3K miles or something u should be ok. dont forget every oil change u will change about 1/2 oil out only, even with swoope's max in out method, maybe 3/4 out./QUOTE]
I realize the VI argument is out there; but that is primarily applicable to mineral oil, and this is a discussion about synthetics. As I understand it, synthetics should not require much VI, though they probably will be needed for the carrier oil for their additives. Nonetheless, a wide range should be much less of an issue for synthetics than for mineral because of their base composition.
#768
Out of NYC
iTrader: (1)
because the wider the range is, the more additives it has, and those modifiers wears out over time. without those additives, the oil will be junk.
but if u change ur oil every say 3K miles or something u should be ok. dont forget every oil change u will change about 1/2 oil out only, even with swoope's max in out method, maybe 3/4 out.
but if u change ur oil every say 3K miles or something u should be ok. dont forget every oil change u will change about 1/2 oil out only, even with swoope's max in out method, maybe 3/4 out.
anyway, changing it often is da key
![Smilie](https://www.rx8club.com/images/smilies/smile.gif)
Last edited by nycgps; 01-07-2009 at 11:33 AM.
#770
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Must say reading through this makes my head ache, but I am curious about the Idemitsu. Any reason people using the premix are using RP over Idemitsu? Is the "racing synthetic" not good on a stock rotor?
#771
Out of NYC
iTrader: (1)
the term Racing is more like a marketing gimmick.
Sometimes having too much of a certain additives doesnt mean its bad for the motor, it might be good for its lubrication, its just that it might create more pollution, and just because of that you will not get that SAE certification for street use
Sometimes having too much of a certain additives doesnt mean its bad for the motor, it might be good for its lubrication, its just that it might create more pollution, and just because of that you will not get that SAE certification for street use
Last edited by nycgps; 02-04-2009 at 01:21 PM.
#772
Out of NYC
iTrader: (1)
Some engine like BMWs use 15w60. Yeah its piston its different, so ?
Too heavy? not quite.
another bad thing with "wide viscosity oil" is that they put MAD additives to create it, and those additives will wear out over time.(Heat, fuel, etc)
but if u change it fast, say 2-3 K miles. IMO its perfectly fine.
There is 5w50 oil from Castrol, no one seems to talk about it.
I use 10w40 now. Im ok with it. Summer time Im gonna go 20w50.
Last edited by nycgps; 02-04-2009 at 01:28 PM.