Cumulative Synthetic Oil Discussion
10-08-2009, 11:22 AM
#1026
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reply from Mobil 1 about the additives used by Royal Purple
One of the things I like about RP is thier claim that their additives form a film on metals that provides protection above and beyond typical hydrodynamic lubrication. My hope is that this will help reduce seal wear on our unique engines.
I don't know if RP's claims are true, but this is an interesting article that seems to validate RP:
http://www.animegame.com/cars/Oil%20Tests.pdf
I'm not saying the above is a definitive test of the oil's effectiveness within an engine (clearly it is not) but, again, it seems to validate that RP's additives do work.
I don't know if RP's claims are true, but this is an interesting article that seems to validate RP:
http://www.animegame.com/cars/Oil%20Tests.pdf
I'm not saying the above is a definitive test of the oil's effectiveness within an engine (clearly it is not) but, again, it seems to validate that RP's additives do work.
Oil Film Strength of Mobil 1 Compared with Royal Purple
Open this link https://www.mobiloil.com/USA-English..._Strength.aspx
sincerely, rxrocks
Last edited by rxrocks; 10-08-2009 at 11:40 AM.
10-08-2009, 11:34 AM
#1027
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That response is far from a straight answer. Mobile1 states that a poor result in a specific test doesnt mean anything because it isnt geared towards modern engines. Why didnt they mention how well there oils stand up to modern engine tests compared to RP?
The reason you do not listen to one manufacturer is because they will never bad mouth their product and will alsways put a positive spin on things. Why do you think ATT, Verizon and Sprint are ALL Americas Number 1 something or other?
The reason you do not listen to one manufacturer is because they will never bad mouth their product and will alsways put a positive spin on things. Why do you think ATT, Verizon and Sprint are ALL Americas Number 1 something or other?
10-08-2009, 11:45 AM
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That response is far from a straight answer. Mobile1 states that a poor result in a specific test doesnt mean anything because it isnt geared towards modern engines. Why didnt they mention how well there oils stand up to modern engine tests compared to RP?
The reason you do not listen to one manufacturer is because they will never bad mouth their product and will alsways put a positive spin on things. Why do you think ATT, Verizon and Sprint are ALL Americas Number 1 something or other?
The reason you do not listen to one manufacturer is because they will never bad mouth their product and will alsways put a positive spin on things. Why do you think ATT, Verizon and Sprint are ALL Americas Number 1 something or other?
i posted it for all to decide for themselves.
rxrocks
10-08-2009, 11:57 AM
#1030
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Yeah, I think RP is a rip off but its your money. $11.00 a quart is BS. Again, your oil choice alone will not save this engine, there have been a couple of failed engines running RP (no fault of the RP itself but still). RP is good stuff but is it worth $4.00 more a quart? I don't think so, any good synthetic at the proper weight, etc. changed every 3k should be fine in terms of engine oil.
10-08-2009, 12:52 PM
#1031
Agreed, RP is expensive, and i cringe every time I buy it. The main reason I buy it is a) it was endorsed by a factory engineer, as well as Racing Beat who have good connections to the factory, and b) my hope is that their above-and-beyond dry lubricant additive package will be beneficial for the apex seals.
Also, it's $8 a quart, not $11. At least for 5w30.
Also, it's $8 a quart, not $11. At least for 5w30.
10-08-2009, 05:50 PM
#1032
Yeah, I think RP is a rip off but its your money. $11.00 a quart is BS. Again, your oil choice alone will not save this engine, there have been a couple of failed engines running RP (no fault of the RP itself but still). RP is good stuff but is it worth $4.00 more a quart? I don't think so, any good synthetic at the proper weight, etc. changed every 3k should be fine in terms of engine oil.
last time I got some pepboys deal I got my RP for like 5 bux a quart
10-08-2009, 07:15 PM
#1033
No, you are not my father
Amazon is selling cases of RP 10w40 for $82.05, which works out to $6.84/quart. I believe I'm going to order me a case here shortly.
http://www.amazon.com/Royal-Purple-S...5046487&sr=1-1
10w30 is $98.95/12
5w30 is $99.95/12
go figure . . . .
I just switched to 10w40 to see how it perfoms relative to viscosity breakdown. In the three oil analyses I've had done with the RX-8 (@ Blackstone Labs), the 5w30 has always tested low. First analysis was with the quickie lube dino oil that the previous owner had put in (forgot the brand and too lazy to look it up). The other two were RP 5w30 sampled at 2500 miles and 4100 miles (at which point I changed the oil and went to the 10w40).
http://www.amazon.com/Royal-Purple-S...5046487&sr=1-1
10w30 is $98.95/12
5w30 is $99.95/12
go figure . . . .
I just switched to 10w40 to see how it perfoms relative to viscosity breakdown. In the three oil analyses I've had done with the RX-8 (@ Blackstone Labs), the 5w30 has always tested low. First analysis was with the quickie lube dino oil that the previous owner had put in (forgot the brand and too lazy to look it up). The other two were RP 5w30 sampled at 2500 miles and 4100 miles (at which point I changed the oil and went to the 10w40).
10-08-2009, 07:40 PM
#1034
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I just switched to 10w40 to see how it perfoms relative to viscosity breakdown. In the three oil analyses I've had done with the RX-8 (@ Blackstone Labs), the 5w30 has always tested low. First analysis was with the quickie lube dino oil that the previous owner had put in (forgot the brand and too lazy to look it up). The other two were RP 5w30 sampled at 2500 miles and 4100 miles (at which point I changed the oil and went to the 10w40).
10-08-2009, 10:12 PM
#1036
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Yeah Autozone has Mobil1 0W-40 and a filter for $26.99. The RP 0W-40 at the same store was $10.99!!!!! I could get 10 quarts of Mobil1 and two filters for the same price. Gotta love the specials, too bad I hate mixing oils. I should have bought five specials when the GC 0W-30 and K&N filter was on special.
10-09-2009, 01:45 PM
#1037
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Seems to me that when determining the "best" oil for our car we really need to think about what application and under what conditions the car is run. If Speedsource and Racing Beat run Synthetics and 7's Only (12A engines) at Buttonwillow all run Synthetic then for racing/high performance applications where you live around redline 90+% this is likely to be the BEST oil. Yeah it's a bit Monkey see Monkey do but we're talking how many decades of direct experience with Rotary engines under extreme stress conditions.
This isn't rocket science guys-just look at what the experts are doing. How often do we see Speedsource blow a motor? Granted they're running the 20B and I don't know how often they're doing rebuilds but because my car sees track duty primarily I'm most concerned about that application. Even when drive on the street I'm typically around 7-8K RPMs. For those of us rarely seeing redline I think it's a totally different ballgame in my opinion. Dino oil for simple daily driver application is proabably fine.
If I see Robert Davis at Buttonwillow this weekend I'll ask him what he's using in their Rx8s. I think it's Redline as well ala 7's Only and they're running Renesis motors pretty close to stock under rediculous temp conditions. My last time there my temps were 230 F with RP. Pretty scary so I backed off. But I'm temped to put some 5W 30 Mobil 1 in when I change my oil this afternoon for the track this weekend.
In my opinion when you switch to Syn you've made the biggest difference in oil quality. Beyond that whether you're running Castol Syn, Redline, or RP you're probably splitting hairs. For daily driver stuff it's 6 of 1, half a dozen of the other IMO.
Interestingly, my car is at the dealer right now getting a recall-reflash to get more oil into the upper housing. It's this sort of apparent deficiency that we all run around with for years that leads to premature engine failure. Bottomline reality is our engines are an evolving science....
This isn't rocket science guys-just look at what the experts are doing. How often do we see Speedsource blow a motor? Granted they're running the 20B and I don't know how often they're doing rebuilds but because my car sees track duty primarily I'm most concerned about that application. Even when drive on the street I'm typically around 7-8K RPMs. For those of us rarely seeing redline I think it's a totally different ballgame in my opinion. Dino oil for simple daily driver application is proabably fine.
If I see Robert Davis at Buttonwillow this weekend I'll ask him what he's using in their Rx8s. I think it's Redline as well ala 7's Only and they're running Renesis motors pretty close to stock under rediculous temp conditions. My last time there my temps were 230 F with RP. Pretty scary so I backed off. But I'm temped to put some 5W 30 Mobil 1 in when I change my oil this afternoon for the track this weekend.
In my opinion when you switch to Syn you've made the biggest difference in oil quality. Beyond that whether you're running Castol Syn, Redline, or RP you're probably splitting hairs. For daily driver stuff it's 6 of 1, half a dozen of the other IMO.
Interestingly, my car is at the dealer right now getting a recall-reflash to get more oil into the upper housing. It's this sort of apparent deficiency that we all run around with for years that leads to premature engine failure. Bottomline reality is our engines are an evolving science....
10-13-2009, 04:43 PM
#1039
Read the last 8 pages and no real answers about what weight/type of oil to use 
Royal Purple 5w20 may be going into my car this weekend and it'll hopefully run great. 20k on my 05, and hopefully it'll last up to at least 100k over the next years.
Any suggestions on a different weight? Don't mean to start any arguments lol.
Royal Purple 5w20 may be going into my car this weekend and it'll hopefully run great. 20k on my 05, and hopefully it'll last up to at least 100k over the next years.
Any suggestions on a different weight? Don't mean to start any arguments lol.
10-13-2009, 04:59 PM
#1040
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Read the last 8 pages and no real answers about what weight/type of oil to use
Royal Purple 5w20 may be going into my car this weekend and it'll hopefully run great. 20k on my 05, and hopefully it'll last up to at least 100k over the next years.
Any suggestions on a different weight? Don't mean to start any arguments lol.
Royal Purple 5w20 may be going into my car this weekend and it'll hopefully run great. 20k on my 05, and hopefully it'll last up to at least 100k over the next years.
Any suggestions on a different weight? Don't mean to start any arguments lol.
Seems to me that when determining the "best" oil for our car we really need to think about what application and under what conditions the car is run.
That being said, I've been suggesting that people who are daily driving their RX8 to stick to a 5w-30 or 0w-30. I'd suggest Royal Purple, Redline or Eneos for excellent quality synthetics. I've used all 3 in my own 2005 Rx8 and I'm about to turn over 90,000 miles.
10-13-2009, 09:40 PM
#1041
You're probably not going to find weight/type in this thread due to this being a synthetic vs. dino discussion mostly.
Senna is right on the money here. The application in which the car is used is the most important factor in oil choice.
That being said, I've been suggesting that people who are daily driving their RX8 to stick to a 5w-30 or 0w-30. I'd suggest Royal Purple, Redline or Eneos for excellent quality synthetics. I've used all 3 in my own 2005 Rx8 and I'm about to turn over 90,000 miles.
Senna is right on the money here. The application in which the car is used is the most important factor in oil choice.
That being said, I've been suggesting that people who are daily driving their RX8 to stick to a 5w-30 or 0w-30. I'd suggest Royal Purple, Redline or Eneos for excellent quality synthetics. I've used all 3 in my own 2005 Rx8 and I'm about to turn over 90,000 miles.
I was debating between 5w-20 and 30. A little more research i guess till the weekend won't hurt. I know everybody's experience will be different.
10-13-2009, 09:48 PM
#1042
10-18-2009, 05:40 PM
#1044
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Seems to me that when determining the "best" oil for our car we really need to think about what application and under what conditions the car is run. If Speedsource and Racing Beat run Synthetics and 7's Only (12A engines) at Buttonwillow all run Synthetic then for racing/high performance applications where you live around redline 90+% this is likely to be the BEST oil. Yeah it's a bit Monkey see Monkey do but we're talking how many decades of direct experience with Rotary engines under extreme stress conditions.
This isn't rocket science guys-just look at what the experts are doing. How often do we see Speedsource blow a motor? Granted they're running the 20B and I don't know how often they're doing rebuilds but because my car sees track duty primarily I'm most concerned about that application. Even when drive on the street I'm typically around 7-8K RPMs. For those of us rarely seeing redline I think it's a totally different ballgame in my opinion. Dino oil for simple daily driver application is proabably fine.
If I see Robert Davis at Buttonwillow this weekend I'll ask him what he's using in their Rx8s. I think it's Redline as well ala 7's Only and they're running Renesis motors pretty close to stock under rediculous temp conditions. My last time there my temps were 230 F with RP. Pretty scary so I backed off. But I'm temped to put some 5W 30 Mobil 1 in when I change my oil this afternoon for the track this weekend.
In my opinion when you switch to Syn you've made the biggest difference in oil quality. Beyond that whether you're running Castol Syn, Redline, or RP you're probably splitting hairs. For daily driver stuff it's 6 of 1, half a dozen of the other IMO.
Interestingly, my car is at the dealer right now getting a recall-reflash to get more oil into the upper housing. It's this sort of apparent deficiency that we all run around with for years that leads to premature engine failure. Bottomline reality is our engines are an evolving science....
This isn't rocket science guys-just look at what the experts are doing. How often do we see Speedsource blow a motor? Granted they're running the 20B and I don't know how often they're doing rebuilds but because my car sees track duty primarily I'm most concerned about that application. Even when drive on the street I'm typically around 7-8K RPMs. For those of us rarely seeing redline I think it's a totally different ballgame in my opinion. Dino oil for simple daily driver application is proabably fine.
If I see Robert Davis at Buttonwillow this weekend I'll ask him what he's using in their Rx8s. I think it's Redline as well ala 7's Only and they're running Renesis motors pretty close to stock under rediculous temp conditions. My last time there my temps were 230 F with RP. Pretty scary so I backed off. But I'm temped to put some 5W 30 Mobil 1 in when I change my oil this afternoon for the track this weekend.
In my opinion when you switch to Syn you've made the biggest difference in oil quality. Beyond that whether you're running Castol Syn, Redline, or RP you're probably splitting hairs. For daily driver stuff it's 6 of 1, half a dozen of the other IMO.
Interestingly, my car is at the dealer right now getting a recall-reflash to get more oil into the upper housing. It's this sort of apparent deficiency that we all run around with for years that leads to premature engine failure. Bottomline reality is our engines are an evolving science....
I'm the owner of a brand new R3 and have been trying to zero in on which oil to use, despite the recommendations in the manual. I have not made up my mind but believe I will end up with full syn 0 or 5w-30. This decision was aided by PMs and emails from several forum members. I never knew that oil discussions could be considered a full contact sport.
10-18-2009, 07:59 PM
#1045
Super Moderator
It is also worth noting that "most" rotaries used in Racing Applications do not use the Factory MOP (here at least).
Instead they throw high ratio's of oil in the fuel to lubricate Apex Seals ALL the time..
Instead they throw high ratio's of oil in the fuel to lubricate Apex Seals ALL the time..
10-19-2009, 03:08 PM
#1046
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I'm driving an '04 and currently using 15w-40 diesel, but I'm about to swap back to 10-40 standard dino for winter (in AZ). I'm coming up on 50k, is that too late to consider switching to synthetic?
10-19-2009, 08:36 PM
#1048
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What I mean by too late, is that switching from dino to synthetic on a high mileage vehicle can often cause seal leaks or loss of compression - basically the weakness was already there, but the dino oil over time filled in the leaking areas with sludge. But when dino is replaced with synthetic, that sludge can loosen up or be not as effective of a plug for the synthetic oil.
10-19-2009, 09:46 PM
#1049
What I mean by too late, is that switching from dino to synthetic on a high mileage vehicle can often cause seal leaks or loss of compression - basically the weakness was already there, but the dino oil over time filled in the leaking areas with sludge. But when dino is replaced with synthetic, that sludge can loosen up or be not as effective of a plug for the synthetic oil.
We dont have head gasket like Pistons.
10-21-2009, 07:23 PM
#1050
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so i sorta need an answer. if I put royal purple in my 2004 rx-8 w/ 58k miles, what oil viscosity should I use. It's also starting to get cool here. best recommendation? I need to do an oil change soon. Also, I have no idea what oil was used in this motor before I bought it. thanks in advance!