cjkim

I'm not sure if this has been posted before but thought it was interesting about MMO
http://www.rx7club.com/showpost.php?...81&postcount=9

now, I'm not saying MMO is insufficient, it does seem to have its followers even on the 7 forums. I've been playing with blends myself and there arent much differences between them (idemitsu, MMO, couple other combos)

Nubo

Actually, the whole thread is interesting. As usual, no conclusive proof about what is best (or better than stock), but interesting that some claim to be running solely MMO premix (without omp), and also a claim that nobody had ever presented evidence of damage from MMO premix on that forum. Personally, I consider my MMO use to be as an "additive". Basically, it's being mixed with the Mobil1 that is being fed through my OMP. :D

MX6_2_RX8

That whole post seems to be based on viscosity and not lubricity. If it were the only criteria why not just run the SAE 140 gear oil? It is clearly higher on the chart. I think there may be a flaw in that argument.

Brettus

iTrader: (2)

/\ good point

StealthTL

iTrader: (1)

I'm currently running an additive intended to replace the missing lubricity caused by removing the sulphur from 'low sulphur diesel'.

All short term experiments with premixes (premixi?) are dogged by the absolute lack of observable feedback - the result I'm looking for is a clean and shiny non-abraded housing at the end of my motors' (longer) life. There is no realistic way to tell what is happening without a motor tear-down.....

(Brettus - I thought 'god point' was very respectful!)

s

Brettus

iTrader: (2)

/\ just tore down my motor and it was as shiny and clean as CRHs' head in there .

Been premixing for 30000 miles - no carbon buildup to speak of on the rotors either

StealthTL

iTrader: (1)

Great news!

S

Brettus

iTrader: (2)

what - that i tore down my motor ?

olddragger

iTrader: (3)

it is best to premix the premix--its a pita, but its the best way to do it. just adding to the tank can cause a gooey mess for a little while. do your own demo.. put your premix in a see through jug--then add gas--with a simple pour as the gas entering the tank is not shooting in like a garden hose. you will see.
also with the ethanol being used now-- we will get more contaminants---better start figuring out the fuel filter.
Race teams (some) ditch the omp altogether. then they run 1 1/2 oz of premix/gal. yes i do mean the rx8
olddragger

MazdaManiac

iTrader: (3)

Uh, no.

First of all, there is no evidence that ethanol is a contaminant or that it conveys contaminants.
It is no more corrosive in pump concentrations than straight gasoline.
It has no practical effect on premix oils that are fully miscible.

Adding the premix to a tank and then filling up is not comparable to the experiment above.
If you want a more accurate comparison, get a 5 gallon pail, put one gallon of gas in it, pour in 5 oz of your 2-cycle oil of choice and then pour 4 more gallons into the bucket from a height of two feet at a rate of 1 gallon every 15 seconds.
What you will get is 100% dilution.

cjkim

Further tests on MMO

ASH8

Hi mate, can you please elaborate, yes I could see that your Rotor housing Face (where apex seals touch) would be clean and shinny, but I have trouble believing that your rotors would be clean as new, I have never seen a perfectly clean used rotor...virtually impossible..

But please I am willing to retract, what ratio and what brand/type of pre-mix were you using, can you supply any pics?

swoope

iTrader: (5)

that is a good point.

but also it depends on the oil / premix you dump in the tank.

premixing the premix is a very good idea. but what do i know..

beers

olddragger

iTrader: (3)

me too-- i know nothing!!!
but i can repeat these things
ethanol--dissolves and loosens any corrosion(maybe we dont have any?)
it can react with mtbe fuel blends--if there is any left?
attracts and absorbs water--no water in gas station tanks are there?
yamaha advises if ethanol is used to carry extra filters with you!(boating--motorcycles etc)
gas companies make a point to say that gas (with ethanol) in the tank should be replaced every 2-3 wks--not a prob--right!
plastic and rubber lines are vulnerable-- do we have those?
advise that if ethanol is used to choose an octane above 91---why is that?
once source even advises to install a water separation filter.
premixing with ethanol in the gas will cause free water in the tank. ethanol actually dissolves the oil displacing the water associated with ethaol/gas blend--probably a small amount--but some non the less.
i could go on--but what is the point? Just remember that ethanol in your gas--changes the gas you are running. it aint doomsday and yes you can run the 10% ethanol--you will get less gas mileage and performance

on the pouring the pre mix in--if your low gas light is on how deep do you think the gas is in your tank? MM has a good point and like I have always advocated (but not 100% practiced myself) keep the tank at least 1/2 full at all times. If you do and then you add the pre mix --you have adequate fuel in the tank to diluted the oil.
OD

Nubo

Agreed. Here's to never finding the answer

invasion08

iTrader: (7)

Off the IdemitsuWebsite


Dear Idemitsu,

Once again, I would like to thank IDEMITSU for providing us a product that is outstanding. Serious engine builders and tuners now have IDEMITSU lubricants that can withstand extreme torture and stress without adding costly additives and stabilizers.

Moving from All Motor to Modified in the NHRA Sport Compact Drag Racing Series, I have had to develop considerably more power (From just over 300 RWHP to close to 1,000 RWHP) with the same 13B engine and the addition of a turbo charger. The results from the R&D, testing and racing we have completed to date have proved beyond our shadow of a doubt that your lubricants “can take the heat”.

I am amazed that each time we inspect our engines & turbo chargers; we have no wear at all associated with the lubricated components. This “peace of mind” permits this team to race with confidence as was the case with our first Modified win August 21, 2005 at Moroso Motorsports Park.

Thank you IDEMITSU for providing usOff the Shelf lubricants that meet and exceed our expectations.

PotatoSoup

And now the introduction of the improved "Series II" RX-8 raises even more questions, especially with regard to how much impact the additional oil injector per rotor will have?

The additional injector is "16X" tech, and has probably been in development for some time.

I can't find any station in my area that's not selling gas with "up to 10% ethanol" in it. If I buy a new (2010) RX-8 next year, I don't think I'm going to use premix. Hopefully the 3rd injector and frequent oil changes using Idemitsu's rotary oil will be sufficient.

Brettus

iTrader: (2)

Didn't say they were like new - just that there was no carbon buildup to speak of . They were indeed black but had no buildup on them .

Have used a variety of premixes - in various ratios but of late around 200:1 to 250:1

9krpmrx8

iTrader: (46)

Fawk this thread is so back and forth. What is the most cost effective method of premixing (which storebought brand is sufficient) and how much of that premix do i add each fillup. I made it through the first 10 pages or so but seriously I think a mod should go through and delete the useless banter.

robrecht

For lubrication and cleaning, the simplest, most cost-effective option is MMO, 5 oz per fill-up.

As long as no one comes along and says it's snake oil, you're good to go and won't have to worry about multiple opinions. BTW, it's not what I use ...

Nubo

Read, baby, READ!


For what it's worth (not much I suppose), I use MMO. I have a used MMO quart bottle which I've marked off with a permanent marker at 6oz intervals. The long neck works well for getting the premix into the tank with as little fuss as possible. I usually add 6oz per fillup if I'm getting a full fill of 13 gallons or so (which I usually do). Otherwise I try to adjust to a similar ratio. I refill the quart bottle from a Gallon container, which runs about $18-20 U.S.. So that's about $1 per fillup and close to 5000 miles between buying gallons. The quart bottle sits nicely in my passthrough compartment alongside my spare quart of oil and some shop rags.

olddragger

iTrader: (3)

do yall think ethanol is going to affect the premixing any?
OD

Varalith

There was another thread where someone had stated (I apologize but I can't remember where or who) that the ethanol would break down any 2 cycle oil you put into your gas tank at the time of fillup and seperate the water out of it.

I would imagine myself as I've been doing this for a year now and haven't had any water in the gas problems that it would probably affect it as such if left for a longer period of time than a week or so, but I burn through a tank in a week usually, two at the most and have never had a problem myself.

I also read in another thread (again I can't remember which one it was or who said it) that the ethanol wasn't good on the apex seals (they did not specify the ethanol itself or possible detonation) but either way, assuming we're talking about just a pure chemical composition problem, I would say that the premix would be a huge boon to our engines if in fact the ethanol is chemically hard on the metal used for the apex seals.

Just my 2 cents from what I've read and seen.

cjkim

BEST PREMIX BUY EVARRRR
went to autozone to stock up on some premix...
looked at: "Mobil 1 Racing 2T" (haven't tried this brand yet so i thought i'd give it a try) and it rang up for....
$.01 EACH

Full Synthetic.. API TC, JASO FC(proposed), ISO-L-EGD cerified... sounds good to me
granted its not JASO FD, but the difference is the level of detergents. i mix detergents in anyways, so no biggie.

needless to say, i cleared out the store (even though it was just 3)

moral of the story: check your autozones, these are being discontinued, so they may ring up very cheap. obviously, YMMV!!