Gas/Oil Premix Thread
09-13-2009, 11:47 AM
#1876
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I just bought and started Idemitsu premix. There is no recommendation that I can find from them to eliminate the OEM oil injection. Without reading all 76 pages here, is there need to do this?
I used 5w-20 per specs for 4 years, changed it every 3,000 miles. Engine tanked at 26,000. Thought I would premix with the new engine. Also going with Idemitsu 10w-30.
I used 5w-20 per specs for 4 years, changed it every 3,000 miles. Engine tanked at 26,000. Thought I would premix with the new engine. Also going with Idemitsu 10w-30.
09-13-2009, 12:07 PM
#1877
Metatron
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What is the difference, content wise, between 2T oil and premixes such as Idemitsu Rotary Premix and Royal Purple?
I don't think anyone outside those companies could tell you about the contents, but they are not the same.
There is no recommendation that I can find from them to eliminate the OEM oil injection. Without reading all 76 pages here, is there need to do this?
No need to disable the stock injection, it uses so little as to be inconsequential.
I don't think anyone outside those companies could tell you about the contents, but they are not the same.
There is no recommendation that I can find from them to eliminate the OEM oil injection. Without reading all 76 pages here, is there need to do this?
No need to disable the stock injection, it uses so little as to be inconsequential.
09-13-2009, 01:16 PM
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09-14-2009, 09:36 AM
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Most people use between 4-8 oz of premix per fillup. As for which premix, I would go with Idemitsu Premix(order online) or for higher availability(local) you can use Saber Pro, MMO, etc. If someone will repost more then this, great. If not, go back and read.
09-14-2009, 10:39 AM
#1881
I got some amsoil Interceptor premix, I couldn't find any saber pro around here, and they are suppose to be similar except the Interceptor has more detergents. It says you can premix 50:1 but at a 12gallon fill up that is 30oz of premix! That seems a bit high... I was thinking more around the 5oz range.
You're ratio is a little bit off. Normally, people here do 1 oz per 3/4 gallons, which ends up being around 5 or 4 ozs respectively.
I think that overall ratio is 1:400 or 1:500.
09-18-2009, 05:55 PM
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Jim Langer of Racing Beat: No Premix
Folks:
I corresponded with Racing Beat via email re Royal Purple (RP), synthetic oils in general, and what premix did they recommend. I have the following mods from them, a few months back: Cold-air intake with ram-air duct; Reflash; Rev-i dual catback exhaust (what a sound!). I was very impressed with them when researching mods for my car and again when I visited in person and had their products installed. Thus, I figured they might be a good source of advice. My "8" has around 85k miles and has always run mineral-based oil. I live in a very hot, dry and dusty area (100 degree-plus in summer) and use my car as a daily driver. Kind of a worst-case scenario, I thought. Imagine my surprise when he said (partly in a previous email, plus the one below) that NO PREMIX IS NECESSARY, THEY DON'T USE IT, and that RP lubes the seals just fine via the pump.
The engine is like a frat party, they doesn't care if it's Bud or Coors... as long as there's enough to go around.
The same with the rotary engine, as long as you keep it lubricated you shouldn't have any problems. Lubrication qualities of RP are actually extremely good, which lowers friction on engine components thereby allowing an increase in power output. Because the lubrication qualities are so high we do not use synthetic oils for race engine break-in, the engine will never break-in on the dyno. We use mineral oil, then switch to synthetic at the end of the break-in session.
One of the main concerns with synthetic oils have been there ability to burn during combustion. Oil that leaves residue, impacts emissions, deteriorates or causes the rubber oil seals to swell all have long term impact on the longevity of the engine. Our thoughts are that since Mazda cannot test every synthetic oil on the market it is easier to say "no" to all.
Best regards,
Jim Langer
Racing Beat, Inc.
I corresponded with Racing Beat via email re Royal Purple (RP), synthetic oils in general, and what premix did they recommend. I have the following mods from them, a few months back: Cold-air intake with ram-air duct; Reflash; Rev-i dual catback exhaust (what a sound!). I was very impressed with them when researching mods for my car and again when I visited in person and had their products installed. Thus, I figured they might be a good source of advice. My "8" has around 85k miles and has always run mineral-based oil. I live in a very hot, dry and dusty area (100 degree-plus in summer) and use my car as a daily driver. Kind of a worst-case scenario, I thought. Imagine my surprise when he said (partly in a previous email, plus the one below) that NO PREMIX IS NECESSARY, THEY DON'T USE IT, and that RP lubes the seals just fine via the pump.
The engine is like a frat party, they doesn't care if it's Bud or Coors... as long as there's enough to go around.
The same with the rotary engine, as long as you keep it lubricated you shouldn't have any problems. Lubrication qualities of RP are actually extremely good, which lowers friction on engine components thereby allowing an increase in power output. Because the lubrication qualities are so high we do not use synthetic oils for race engine break-in, the engine will never break-in on the dyno. We use mineral oil, then switch to synthetic at the end of the break-in session.
One of the main concerns with synthetic oils have been there ability to burn during combustion. Oil that leaves residue, impacts emissions, deteriorates or causes the rubber oil seals to swell all have long term impact on the longevity of the engine. Our thoughts are that since Mazda cannot test every synthetic oil on the market it is easier to say "no" to all.
Best regards,
Jim Langer
Racing Beat, Inc.
09-18-2009, 05:57 PM
#1885
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09-18-2009, 06:00 PM
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09-18-2009, 06:16 PM
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"The engine is like a frat party, they doesn't care if it's Bud or Coors... as long as there's enough to go around."
Well, there was obviously not enough to go around as evidenced by all the engine failures. You can see the excessive wear in the tear downs of early Renesis engines. Does this mean MSP16 = Mazda going on a keg run?
premix = preparty. I always arrive liquored up from the start.
Well, there was obviously not enough to go around as evidenced by all the engine failures. You can see the excessive wear in the tear downs of early Renesis engines. Does this mean MSP16 = Mazda going on a keg run?
premix = preparty. I always arrive liquored up from the start.
09-18-2009, 06:18 PM
#1888
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Imagine my surprise when he said (partly in a previous email, plus the one below) that NO PREMIX IS NECESSARY, THEY DON'T USE IT, and that RP lubes the seals just fine via the pump.
Geez, there is NO other way to get oil to the middle of Apex Seal unless you Pre-Mix (in a Series I)..
To turn around and say pre-mixing is NOT NECCESSARY...is just not correct.
I would ask them why did Mazda change the MOP setup...??
Because the reality is some of these guys would not even KNOW about the Changes or even looked at a Series II Engine, they have just turned 1 year old..
Last edited by ASH8; 09-18-2009 at 06:23 PM.
09-21-2009, 02:58 PM
#1890
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Hmmm. Maybe. I wonder if every other car manufacturer tests every synthetic oil on the market. They also have rubber seals, need to eliminate carbon deposits, etc. etc.. I think the problems in the '70s, having to replace so many engines, fried their brains. Since the rotary division is most likely small and close-knit some of those people are still around and surely given much deference. Then the Renesis engines start dying. Well, you can imagine how people fall back on old ideas. Just my theory.
09-21-2009, 04:09 PM
#1891
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Hmmm. Maybe. I wonder if every other car manufacturer tests every synthetic oil on the market. They also have rubber seals, need to eliminate carbon deposits, etc. etc.. I think the problems in the '70s, having to replace so many engines, fried their brains. Since the rotary division is most likely small and close-knit some of those people are still around and surely given much deference. Then the Renesis engines start dying. Well, you can imagine how people fall back on old ideas. Just my theory.
Mazda engineers in the past have stated two brands by name. They said Mobile 1 was a no no and Valvoline synthetics were fine.
09-26-2009, 02:38 AM
#1892
Folks:
I corresponded with Racing Beat via email re Royal Purple (RP), synthetic oils in general, and what premix did they recommend. I have the following mods from them, a few months back: Cold-air intake with ram-air duct; Reflash; Rev-i dual catback exhaust (what a sound!). I was very impressed with them when researching mods for my car and again when I visited in person and had their products installed. Thus, I figured they might be a good source of advice. My "8" has around 85k miles and has always run mineral-based oil. I live in a very hot, dry and dusty area (100 degree-plus in summer) and use my car as a daily driver. Kind of a worst-case scenario, I thought. Imagine my surprise when he said (partly in a previous email, plus the one below) that NO PREMIX IS NECESSARY, THEY DON'T USE IT, and that RP lubes the seals just fine via the pump.
The engine is like a frat party, they doesn't care if it's Bud or Coors... as long as there's enough to go around.
The same with the rotary engine, as long as you keep it lubricated you shouldn't have any problems. Lubrication qualities of RP are actually extremely good, which lowers friction on engine components thereby allowing an increase in power output. Because the lubrication qualities are so high we do not use synthetic oils for race engine break-in, the engine will never break-in on the dyno. We use mineral oil, then switch to synthetic at the end of the break-in session.
One of the main concerns with synthetic oils have been there ability to burn during combustion. Oil that leaves residue, impacts emissions, deteriorates or causes the rubber oil seals to swell all have long term impact on the longevity of the engine. Our thoughts are that since Mazda cannot test every synthetic oil on the market it is easier to say "no" to all.
Best regards,
Jim Langer
Racing Beat, Inc.
I corresponded with Racing Beat via email re Royal Purple (RP), synthetic oils in general, and what premix did they recommend. I have the following mods from them, a few months back: Cold-air intake with ram-air duct; Reflash; Rev-i dual catback exhaust (what a sound!). I was very impressed with them when researching mods for my car and again when I visited in person and had their products installed. Thus, I figured they might be a good source of advice. My "8" has around 85k miles and has always run mineral-based oil. I live in a very hot, dry and dusty area (100 degree-plus in summer) and use my car as a daily driver. Kind of a worst-case scenario, I thought. Imagine my surprise when he said (partly in a previous email, plus the one below) that NO PREMIX IS NECESSARY, THEY DON'T USE IT, and that RP lubes the seals just fine via the pump.
The engine is like a frat party, they doesn't care if it's Bud or Coors... as long as there's enough to go around.
The same with the rotary engine, as long as you keep it lubricated you shouldn't have any problems. Lubrication qualities of RP are actually extremely good, which lowers friction on engine components thereby allowing an increase in power output. Because the lubrication qualities are so high we do not use synthetic oils for race engine break-in, the engine will never break-in on the dyno. We use mineral oil, then switch to synthetic at the end of the break-in session.
One of the main concerns with synthetic oils have been there ability to burn during combustion. Oil that leaves residue, impacts emissions, deteriorates or causes the rubber oil seals to swell all have long term impact on the longevity of the engine. Our thoughts are that since Mazda cannot test every synthetic oil on the market it is easier to say "no" to all.
Best regards,
Jim Langer
Racing Beat, Inc.
if not i will.
beers
09-30-2009, 02:42 PM
#1894
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Also, you can do a thorough soaking with one of those or "zoom zoom cleaner", search for "diy engine decarb". It can foul your plugs, so I'm about to do it before I swap out my plugs and coils since I'm due for those at 42k.
10-03-2009, 04:22 PM
#1897
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I've never heard that. Quite the contrary. Using agressive cleaners can harm the oil films inside your engine so I've heard people recommend maybe a little more premix when you also want to use aggressive cleaners.
