jmc23200

I have heard to run an aggressive cleaner through a tank with no premix then use extra premix on the next tank. Maybe because the aggressive cleaner is so aggressive that it will counter act the premix and its just a waste of money. Who knows, do what makes you happy

As for carbon removal, REDLINE ATLEAST once a day!! A Redline A Day keeps the Carbon away.

robrecht

But who says that?
No diagreement there!

Spirograph

Yeah, as for who says that, I think the concept falls in line with the way that Mazda does the more thorough zoom-zoom cleaning - they don't add premix while running the foaming cleanser through the engine, but they then crank up the OMP dosage immediately after the cleaning for a short time. Someone correct me if I'm wrong.

As to the Lucas Upper Cylinder Lubricant, doesn't that cause problems when run in conjunction with other premixes? Just something to be aware of.

robrecht

Not really comparable. Most of the time that the cleaner is soaking in the engine during the Mazda cleaning procedure, the engine is turned off, and then it is only run for a short time. If you're running an aggressive cleaner through the gas tank without any premix you run the risk of harming your oil films for some 250-300 miles.

Personally, I use a lubricous decarboning cleaner (FP+) in every tank (with Idemitsu) so I don't see a need for using more aggressive solvent additives.

CarAndDriver

I've just been using FP Plus, but will start adding 4-6 ounces of MMO per tank. Worth a shot. May try Idemitsu one of these days when my bank account allows.

madcows

Hey! I just bought a quart of belray, and a gallon of amsoil from a local motorcycle shop. My total came out to something like $7,385,295.99... It was the best I could do without ordering online.

The BelRay is supposed to be fine for premix, and oil injection applications. It is pretty thick, but the bottle says it's ok . The thickness seems to be similar to the Motul I ran for a little while. No problems, but then again, it was just a quart, and I didn't use it *every* tank.

9krpmrx8

iTrader: (46)

What do you guys think about using standard premix in the SOHN tank and Lucas UCL in the fuel?

Swoope?

Spirograph

I'd personally say you're better off with just 8 oz. MMO per tank, plus it's cheaper. Then you can save the money until you can afford a case of Idemitsu to mix with the MMO (4 oz. each, or whatever ratio fits the budget).


As for Lucas UCL, I don't see that mentioned here often. I think when I first got my 8 this summer and started reading here, I seem to recall a thread where people warned against using Lucas - at least if it's being mixed with anything else. One guy had experimented with mixing various premixes and lubricious cleaners, and he swears that the death of his first engine was due to Lucas not mixing well with others. Plus, I'm not a big Lucas product fan after seeing a video of a gear test showing that while the Lucas oil additive did help the oil to climb gears, that it also caused bad frothing which would be much more destructive to an engine than the positive effects of the oil climbing. Hmm, maybe that additive would be good in a rotary mixed with 15-40 diesel oil - the anti-frothing agents in the diesel oil might counteract that action, while the climbing effect of the Lucas would help with cold start damage caused by running an oil with a thick cold start viscosity.

9krpmrx8

iTrader: (46)

When I looked into it I found lucas has some great lubrication properties and burns off well. Stealth has been premixing it since day one and he works in the field so I'm comfortable with it as a premix alone, just wondering now that I am premixing 2 stroke via the SOHN, if there will be any issues. Paging Stealth.

StealthTL

iTrader: (1)

I think the idea of keeping the Lucas away from the two-stroke is a solid concept.

I was pre-mixing heavily with both, but I also developed (pioneered?) the slime in the gas tank that chokes off the sock filter.

Further trials indicated it WAS the combination of the two, as neither component formed the scum on it's own, but together the problem reappeared.

Lucas is great stuff, and I will continue to use it.

I have bought a Sohn.......

S

9krpmrx8

iTrader: (46)

So, will you run Lucas in your SOHN? I thought of it but question the fact that it is not a traditional "Premix" . I just like the fact that I don't get tail pipe soot and the stinky smell with the Lucas.

swoope

iTrader: (5)

you will love this..

did my first track weekend with no drama... have been useing mmo for the daily mix....

but my motor is old and getting weak. so i did 16oz of redline to a tank for the track event.. an i did PREMIX THE PREMIX!!!!!!!!

two days, car did not miss a beat.... this was with a used ~20k mile pump. special sock..

ran it to about 1/3 tank..

i have an idea about fuel pumps now.. but great to have a no drama weekend..

beers

swoope

iTrader: (5)

why?
it would make more sense to do sohn and fp+ or mmo in the tank.

i am learning part of the issue is how much you omp puts out..

mine is low... and always has been..

food for thought.


beers

swoope

iTrader: (5)

note to some of the above..

44k is a great cleaner.. it will do nothing for the fuel pump sock..

beers

9krpmrx8

iTrader: (46)

Mine seem to be high. I did the SOHN on Saturday and I marked the reservoir to see if lower to make sure it's working and it has used a bit and I doubt I have driven more than 150 miles or so since then.

MMO in the tank would be cheaper. How is that working for you? How much MMO do you use? I have just read up on MMO and I cannot figure what it is made of and if it lubricates more than it cleans or vice versa. Thanks.

CarAndDriver

I'll give it a shot. Have to get to my next fill up and try MMO on its own and see what happens. I still have about 1/4 a bottle of FP+ left.

Nubo

The datasheet has been posted at some point. Basically some solvents and lightweight oil, and some phosphorus for boundary-layer lubrication, iirc.

My speculation is that it makes sense as a supplement to what the OMP puts out -- adding to the physical volume of what is on the housing and helping spread it around while adding some lubrication of its own. And the phosphorus makes sense to me in this regime where I don't expect a traditional oil film to always prevail in any case. I'm hoping the solvent component will help combat excessive carbon buildup around the seals and ports.

I tend to go with 250:1 for use as supplement to the OMP.

I have no conclusive data to back any of this up.

9krpmrx8

iTrader: (46)

Thanks. I just don't want any type of solvent to degrade what the OMP is injecting.

GeorgeH

iTrader: (2)

I've searched this thread (and others) about Royal Purple TCW III, and found the comments about TCW in general not being suitable for high-temp conditions, like those found in our motors.

So, I emailed RP's tech support, and heard back from one of their guys who ran a 250 hp, normally aspirated, 12A in an RX-3, in SCCA GT3 for two seasons. He used RP TCW III as his premix without issue. And, note that there was no MOP/OMP present - so the seals were completely dependent on premix for lubrication. Exhaust temps were in the 1550-1700F range.

So, it would seem that there should be no problem using RP TCW III as a premix in the Renesis. Think I'll give it a try.

9krpmrx8

iTrader: (46)

Yeah from what I found the biggest problem with the TC3W stuff is its effect on the Cat Converter. I don't have a cat so that is why I don't mind it. The only problem has been smell. The Lucas in the fuel does not smell or leave residue but I'm not sure sure about using it as a replacement for 2 stroke in the SOHN. I am waiting to hear back from Lucas. Lucas also makes a synthetic 2 stroke.

GeorgeH

iTrader: (2)

Ah, yes, if there is an issue with cats then one should be careful.

Although, I went through a cat when I wasn't pre-mixing, so I'm not sure how worried I am about this. Is there good evidence that a TCW oil is harder on cats?

9krpmrx8

iTrader: (46)

Yes there is some reading in this thread about it I believe or maybe it is in my "show me your premix" thread.

GeorgeH

iTrader: (2)

I did ask the RP guy about cat life, and he felt the RP TCW III oil is friendlier to the cat than the normal engine oil. Of course, RP can't tell us that our cats will be unaffected by this, but the TCW stuff is nearly ash-free.

Of course, this is from an oil vendor so y'all can interpret it as you like. Just passing the info on.

swoope

iTrader: (5)

george.

you know what i am running for a cat.. btw, it just passed 30k miles.. and 4 more track days..

as to the mmo questions.. i have been running 8oz for the street..

and i just did the track day with redline at 16oz in the tank.. btw, i mixed it with gas before i put it in.. that is important!!!!

and rpmrx8..

let me know how much oil you go through with the sholn.

as most of then reason i premix is my omp is not very active..

drove 300 miles to the track weekend. did 8 20 min sessions.. then 300 miles home..

about 1 qt of oil used.. hopefully you will use more..

beers

ganseg

iTrader: (5)

I read this and related comments after I put in 3.5 oz of Lucas and 3.5 oz of premix (Amsoil Saber Outboard - the product Amsoil recommended out of the 30 choices they have). Am I in trouble here?

As soon as I had room for 5 gal of gas, i added that. I won't be opposed to driving around like an idiot today (cornering hard trying to keep my Lucas mixed, redlining frequently). Not sure that my wife will buy that I have to do that to protect the car.