Not just the average LS2 coil question
03-10-2010, 10:58 AM
#26
Ya know what is so frustrating about things like this? The fact that people are so willing to do business with a company who is violating patent laws and build their own coil conversion kits to "save" $85-$165 in the process. Then, we all sit around and wonder why there are not more companies developing effective product for the RX-8.
If you guys don't think there is a direct corollary between threads like this and the products offered by companies in the aftermarket......... guess again. The profits made from product sales goes directly to new product development.
$325 (plus shipping) to "try it" or $485 (shipped in the US) to have your *** covered in a LOT of ways. Plus, a few details have been overlooked with this particular DIY strategy.
Just sayin'.
If you guys don't think there is a direct corollary between threads like this and the products offered by companies in the aftermarket......... guess again. The profits made from product sales goes directly to new product development.
$325 (plus shipping) to "try it" or $485 (shipped in the US) to have your *** covered in a LOT of ways. Plus, a few details have been overlooked with this particular DIY strategy.
Just sayin'.
Last edited by cornholio135; 03-10-2010 at 11:01 AM.
03-10-2010, 11:20 AM
#27
SARX Legend
iTrader: (46)
The Yukon coils have heat sinks built in and I don't believe they are as prone to damage from the heat. Also, in searching I could not find a single case of BHR specific Yukon coils failing (not all LS coils are the same).
That being said, I think there is some skill involved in the making of the harnesses themselves and the wires. I have seen some pretty shitty wiring in the past so a warranty is a must IMO
I would hate to have a short or something in the harness and no warranty. I am all for supporting small businesses in America that make products to be sold in America so if I have to pay a bit more then it's all good.
That being said, I think there is some skill involved in the making of the harnesses themselves and the wires. I have seen some pretty shitty wiring in the past so a warranty is a must IMO
I would hate to have a short or something in the harness and no warranty. I am all for supporting small businesses in America that make products to be sold in America so if I have to pay a bit more then it's all good.
03-10-2010, 11:29 AM
#28
The Yukon coils have heat sinks built in and I don't believe they are as prone to damage from the heat. Also, in searching I could not find a single case of BHR specific Yukon coils failing (not all LS coils are the same).
That being said, I think there is some skill involved in the making of the harnesses themselves and the wires. I have seen some pretty shitty wiring in the past so a warranty is a must IMO
I would hate to have a short or something in the harness and no warranty. I am all for supporting small businesses in America that make products to be sold in America so if I have to pay a bit more then it's all good.
That being said, I think there is some skill involved in the making of the harnesses themselves and the wires. I have seen some pretty shitty wiring in the past so a warranty is a must IMO
I would hate to have a short or something in the harness and no warranty. I am all for supporting small businesses in America that make products to be sold in America so if I have to pay a bit more then it's all good.
03-10-2010, 12:21 PM
#29
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I apologize if this thread offends BHR or any vendor - its not my intent.
I was avoiding getting detailed in a public forum (which is why I contacted BHR via email and PM instead - but no direct answer was given yet) because if what I learned is not true, i dont want people to freak out.
Essentially, as I understand it - the D585 coil is a self-dwell current limited coil which can potentially cause problems if the dwell time goes on a little too long at cranking speeds. High end EMS ignition expanders wont work specifically with the 19005218 d585 coil.
Subsequently, the d510c has closer dwell times to the stock rx8 and as such, safer than the d585.
What I'm trying to confirm is if in fact people are using the d585 19005218 coil (BHR kit or otherwise) and what research/issues arose from this if any at all?
If the d585 19005218 is completely safe, great, because thats what I have right now (not installed) - but I'm amazed that all these people with ls2 coils, bhr kits, etc cant confirm the number as its stamped on the coil itself.
this is NOT an attack, and I dont intend to harm any product's reputation, just trying to be a savvy tuner....
I was avoiding getting detailed in a public forum (which is why I contacted BHR via email and PM instead - but no direct answer was given yet) because if what I learned is not true, i dont want people to freak out.
Essentially, as I understand it - the D585 coil is a self-dwell current limited coil which can potentially cause problems if the dwell time goes on a little too long at cranking speeds. High end EMS ignition expanders wont work specifically with the 19005218 d585 coil.
Subsequently, the d510c has closer dwell times to the stock rx8 and as such, safer than the d585.
What I'm trying to confirm is if in fact people are using the d585 19005218 coil (BHR kit or otherwise) and what research/issues arose from this if any at all?
If the d585 19005218 is completely safe, great, because thats what I have right now (not installed) - but I'm amazed that all these people with ls2 coils, bhr kits, etc cant confirm the number as its stamped on the coil itself.
this is NOT an attack, and I dont intend to harm any product's reputation, just trying to be a savvy tuner....
Last edited by WE3RX7; 03-10-2010 at 12:24 PM.
03-10-2010, 03:20 PM
#30
I am not Easy, I am Charles. 
We understand that everyoine likes to save money and when we establish our prices it is with this concept in-mind. That is an element of Capitalism to which I adhere.
We offer the harness as a separate item but the fact that we can make them in custom-lengths was mistakenly omitted from our website listing. That is my fault.
Keep in mind that I switched from LS-2 to Yukon coils because the heatsinks render concerns for overheating a moot point. We have nearly 400 kits installed around the world and dozens of F/I applications, too, and none of the coils has ever overheated while located in the factory position.
Are you SURE you covered all the parts?
We understand that everyoine likes to save money and when we establish our prices it is with this concept in-mind. That is an element of Capitalism to which I adhere.
We offer the harness as a separate item but the fact that we can make them in custom-lengths was mistakenly omitted from our website listing. That is my fault.
Keep in mind that I switched from LS-2 to Yukon coils because the heatsinks render concerns for overheating a moot point. We have nearly 400 kits installed around the world and dozens of F/I applications, too, and none of the coils has ever overheated while located in the factory position.
Are you SURE you covered all the parts?
Last edited by cornholio135; 03-10-2010 at 03:22 PM.
03-10-2010, 03:52 PM
#31
Stupidity keeps me busy!!
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1) Actually, yes, the "magic beans" are the several variations of fitments, brackets, etc., that are executed until we decide on a final version to bring to market. The version you are proud to say you are "copying" or reverse-engineering. None of which was free for BHR or it's associates.
2) So far, your outcome has not been "identical". Your brackets assembly is not identical, your harness is not identical, and your spark plug wires did not fit the first time.
3) Thanks. We plan on adding more tech pages and such as we have more time. Websites seem to be an organic thing where, if we do not constantly update it, people will quickly lose interest.
The irony in this conversation are the thoughts which were provoked in Flashwing's own mind as he realized a few things about his own purchasing habits, and his conclusions about them as he thought them all through.
I learned a long time ago that what one THINKS they are paying for when buying any product isn't always what they are ACTUALLY buying. What I mean by this goes, again, to your "magic beans" comment. If you strictly look at the component parts of these kinds of ignition systems you see bracketry, coils, and wires. On the other hand, we are now in the "Information Age", where people earn livings based on their thoughts and ideas and this is where BH makes our livings, as well. THIS, and the best after-sale support and warranty coverage, are what you pay for when you do biz with BHR.
What I will be waiting for is someone to reverse-engineer the Mazmart Water Pump and offer it for a lower price. Or Race Roots' oil pan.
2) So far, your outcome has not been "identical". Your brackets assembly is not identical, your harness is not identical, and your spark plug wires did not fit the first time.
3) Thanks. We plan on adding more tech pages and such as we have more time. Websites seem to be an organic thing where, if we do not constantly update it, people will quickly lose interest.
The irony in this conversation are the thoughts which were provoked in Flashwing's own mind as he realized a few things about his own purchasing habits, and his conclusions about them as he thought them all through.
I learned a long time ago that what one THINKS they are paying for when buying any product isn't always what they are ACTUALLY buying. What I mean by this goes, again, to your "magic beans" comment. If you strictly look at the component parts of these kinds of ignition systems you see bracketry, coils, and wires. On the other hand, we are now in the "Information Age", where people earn livings based on their thoughts and ideas and this is where BH makes our livings, as well. THIS, and the best after-sale support and warranty coverage, are what you pay for when you do biz with BHR.
What I will be waiting for is someone to reverse-engineer the Mazmart Water Pump and offer it for a lower price. Or Race Roots' oil pan.
to address a few of your comments, i completely understand being payed for R&D and billing accordingly and in no way do i feel that your product is overpriced. i also understand the feeling of accomplishment when doing it yourself and enjoy having something i built myself in my vehicle.
I saw a picture of your product and thought that i could build something that could secure the coils as well. i tried a few different ways of securing the coils to a bracket and found that curving the metal around the coils as seen in my pictures was the strongest and most secure while keeping the coils as compact as possible. this made building the bracket more complicated as i was working with a hammer and a bench vise so it took quite a bit of time to make all of the curves the same, flatter across the other side of the coils would have been much easier but didn't keep the coils close enough together.
the information is out there as you said that we live in the information age. information is out there that these coils will work with a given harness that can be supplied by a few vendors and i was unaware of any potential copyright issues if they do exist. the problem being you have to build your own brackets. i enjoy the trial and error and was quite lucky to nail it on the first try fitting into the vehicle, as i understood the LS series coils are much less prone to heat problems than the stock coils are and i was not worried about the mounting location.
to clarify, the wires did fit the first time but i would prefer to have them a little longer.
i am not putting out a product, i am modifying my own vehicle and if i was putting out a product i would have to put a warranty or some sort of guarantee along with the product i would be putting out. this would also increase the price of any given product. that being said, again your product is fantastically priced for what is being purchased. as far as identical, i was referring to performance outcome. not visual outcome.
my comments in no way were intended to be offensive and if they came off that way I apologize. i was only intending to point out that a, lets call it "similar" outcome can be obtained for less money. If i had the money i would love to have the BHR ignition system. i honestly can't wait till i can get your midpipe. I have seen one in person and heard it and only wish you and BHR the best of luck clarifying the issues you have had with production or supply or whatever the issue is, and will be ordering a ZEX kit with your throttle body adapter and flywheel and clutch kit from you when i need it as well as a AP from Mazdamaniac until i can afford a turbo kit if i feel that i need more power. and if i do go that route it would only be through your company as well.
my intent was not to copy your bracket but to create my own that would work for me. it just so happens that you have created a fantastic product that condenses the coils as tightly as possible and i found that out through trial and error and mine resembles yours. as you can read in one of my previous posts. I bought a 4 ft long piece of 3/4"X1/8" alluminum and made a bracket that looks almost exactly like the BHR one except I mounted my braket to the factory one this was said because i found out that the way you mounted the coils was the most space efficient.
by the way, here is a couple of pictures from in the car. sorry, my camera is F'd up so i had to take them from my Blackberry.
and if i bought your system i wouldn't be able to show you a picture of my cute dog's nose.
Last edited by E.M.S.; 03-10-2010 at 03:56 PM.
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