indeed this was an awesome thread! If it would have been in person i think some punches and kicks would have been spread.
Either way, Good night guys! It would have been fun to have ad this chat live in a chat room

 

Now that's awesome! Did they give it to you in service, or when you bought the car?

I personally would love to have one in hand with the senior service tech around!

If it was service, did they go around the car (ie, write the license plate or vin down?)

 

OK FD...see ya. Get your Facts straight next time about the RX8 before spouting off. We try to keep things accurate as possible........

 

Exactly my point! So, next time you post about the evils of synthetic oil, please do not refer to the little addendum from Mazda which may or may not get mailed out to owners, or even to their service manual, should it ever be updated.

As for your other comment, courtesy of the Pettit Racing web site:

DIRECTIONS:
Add Protek-R to tank before adding fuel using the following formula:
STREET: Minimum of one 4-oz bottle per full 12 gallon tank
RACE: Mix at Ratio 100:1

Have you really been adding it to your oil all this time??? :D

 

They gave me the book when I bought the car. Its not a service manual though. Its all about the Renesis design program, and some history of the Rotary at Mazda. Its a pretty cool book, especially for free.

 

syntrix, YOU crack me up! Anyway...
...If you don't trust what Mazda says about the parts they provide stock on the last gen RX-7 (and rightfully so, both of what you mentioned were totally inadequate) then why should I trust what Mazda says with the "no synthetic oil recomended" statement that, as Syntrix put it, is not mentioned in the owners manual? All the evidence points to the fact that synthetic is better in every way when compared to dino oil. I have trouble seeing otherwise without some documented proof showing the ill effects to synthetics in rotaries.

BTW, Syntrix, why wouldn't YOU use synthetic in your rx-8? You seemed convinced Mazda hasn't shown us **** proving synth is bad or even not recomended. Given the facts showing how good synth. is, why not use it?

 

Ding ding ding!

Glad you all are realizing the facts here!

 

Simple, why would I rely on speculation?

I'm running dino for a while.. part of good break in on any engine, and even after the fact.

FACT IS: Why does Mazda not specify that synth is bad in the manual?

Apparently they did this in the FD, but NOT THE RX8 MANUAL.

So what facts do you have from Mazda about not running synths that are to the owners manual spec?

I'm tired of typing that last question. I typically change at 5k miles on all cars I've owned in my 17 year history... for now it's dyno. In 5k it could by synth.

But what is MAZDA saying about SYNTH, at least OFFICALLY? If they can't say it publically to all owners, then I can run SYNTH at my next oil change!

Simple as that!

 

Either way, this is good fun.

I just want to see the offical statement from Mazda!!!! Or at least in some sort of documentation to the masses.

GAWD, I sound like a broken record! LOL

 

:p :D syntrix et al, I'm surprised you continued to argue with this newbie - he shows up today spouting all these so-called facts, even calling US newbies, yet doesn't know anything at all about the changes to the RX-8. He's an RX-7 expert, and starts holding forth all this crap based solely on his experience with RX-7s without even bothering to learn the differences to the 8. I already told him his credibility was shot (1st page of this thread) when he claimed the hp on the auto RX-8 was lower because of the fuel injection!!! While this doofus is entertaining, he's obviously pretty ignorant, and just looks like a jerk when he shows up here wanting to be a big shot who can tell everyone what they should be doing.

Entertaining thread - but I'll still be using Castrol Syntec for oil changes between dealer changes. After all, if you listen to Mobil (ref their lawsuit a few years ago), Syntec isn't really synthetic oil anyways, since Castrol doesn't use the real synth base stock. Mobil charged that Syntec is just ultra-refined dino oil - and the judge said that's OK, they can still call it synthetic. So, RX-7 dude - if Syntec isn't really synthetic, is it now OK to use in my RX-8? :p :D

Regards,
Gordon

 

Entertaining is the word.

Not really arguing, just trying to find some Mazda sponsored facts for the RX8, not something in a legacy manual for an older car that does not apply to a new engine

Gord, as long as it's SL 5W-20 as specified on page 8-9 of your owners manual..... hehehreheh, I already posted that, LOL LOL LOL.

Glad someone has a good attitude on this board!!!!!!!

I think I'm going to go synth to spec at the next change, until Mazda sends me a letter and pays for cost on my "synth" oil change to avoid any potential late "notification" issues.

For all we know Mazda is watching our posts right now!

 

Do they make 5W20 in sythetic? I see 5W30 alot, but no 5W20. I like Mobil1, if they make it, someone please post.

 

That's a good point.... don't see anything in that weight, but a 5-30 could break down and an oil test could show 5-20!

I think that's mazda's way out... I think the only thing I recall is is a 0-20 or a 0-30. HMMMMMMM....

I'll have to call some vendors on monday, or check some sources tomorrow.

But this is a whole new can of worms about weight in summertime and doing autox/road courses!


This post get more intersting by the minute (see times about 1 or 2 pages back with responses )

 

I figured 5W30 synth. would resist breakdown at least as good, if not better, than 5W20 dino. Someone else mentioned about 5W20 being used by Mazda for slightly better gas mileage and that 5W30 would protect just as well. Don't know if this is true, just what I heard.

 

5W30 is the oil specification for Oz.

Haven't read anything in RX8 docs specifying dino only, but the service guy's say "dino only" and I know them and trust them. That's frankly enough for me!

 

Synthetic oil is fine the flash point is only about 30 degrees F more that regular dino oil. Synthetic oil is just a little better at fighting of the point a when it goes from a liquid to a gas when it get burned. I think the reason Mazda does not want you to use synthetic oil is because it affects the seals just a little differently. In that it has a little more acid content to it. They dont want you to go between dino then synthetic then back. If you use synthetic stick with it. Or if you use dino stick with it. If Racing beat uses it. It is fine, I am going to start using Royal Purple.

 

Yes, I've read this before, though not directly from Mazda and not about rotaries. The assertion was that dino oil has a tendency to make seals swell a bit. By seals we're talking about elastic seals, not apex). The point was that if you decide on synth then go with it right from 1st oil change. If you decide dino, stick with it. The worst case was running dino for a long time and switching to synth. Idea being that the engine had run with "swollen" seals and now they'd shrink.

The exception was if you were using synth and at high mileage noticed a small oil leak starting you might think about changing to dino to swell the seals a bit and stop the leak. This was about 10-15 years ago so don't know if it still applies. Seal materials or oil properties may have changed.

 

:D I gues that other "users guide" is like the Book of Mormon :D

 

I am stunned at how I started a small post of information and create a firestorm. In all that I have read I have even detected that someone had doubted the e-mail to Mazda USA that I sent.

There are certainly things that do NOT make sense to me. Why wasn't it mentioned in the owners manual NOT to use synthetic oils? Why is it mentioned in other documents (like the one that was scanned and posted)? Why did Mazda USA respond not to use synthetics, but yet not put it in the manual? Why does the service department at my Mazda dealership (Browns in Fairfax, VA) say not to use synthetics, but it is not in the manual?

For anyone who is interested, below is the ENTIRE e-mail to and from Mazda USA. As you can see I asked before my RX-8 arrived since I had heard synthetics should not be used. Maybe others should go to Mazda USA'a web site and e-mail them with not only why shouldn't synthetic oil be used, but why it isn't in the manual?

Take care,
Glen

__________________________________________________ __
Hello Glen,

Thank you for contacting Mazda North American Operations. I appreciate the opportunity to respond to you.

In regards to your inquiry, Mazda does not suggest synthetic oil use for the RX-8. The reason for this is that the Rotary engines must burn oil in the combustion chambers. Because synthetic oil burns at a high temperature it may not fully burn in the combustion chambers causing seals to stick.

I hope this answers your question. Please let me know if you need any further assistance.

Again, thank you for contacting Mazda. It has been my pleasure to assist you. If for any reason this response has not completely
satisfied you, please feel free to reply to this message. You may also contact our Customer Assistance Center toll-free at 1-800-222-5500.

Please take a moment of your time to give us your opinion about our e-mail service. Click the link below to complete a brief, online
survey.

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Heather Drake
Specialist, Customer Assistance E-Business




Original Message Follows:
------------------------


Form Message

Email Address: Glen220@(Deleted by me)
First Name: Glen
Last Name: (Deleted by me)
Title: Mr.
Message Zip: 20136
Subject1: Ownership & Maintenance
Subject2: Service & Maintenance
Current Mazda Owner: true
Model: RX-8
Year: 2004
Message Body: I am awaiting the arrival of an RX-8 that I have
ordered. I have used Mobil 1 synthetic motor oil in all of my cars
(including an RX-7) and have been very pleased with it. Recently I have read that you should not use a synthetic motor oil in a rotary engine, is this true?? I had planned on using Mobil 1 in my RX-8 when it arrives, unless you tell me not to. Thanks, Glen

 

Hi Glen,

Thanks for posting the whole email. I don't think anybody doubted YOU but the possible 19 year old intern who could be pulling this out of his/her ........

We seem to be making progress here with your email and the this new brochure from Mazda.

 

Come on, guys, when you read this, try to think like a lawyer (since it's guaranteed that a lawyer wrote it, not an engineer). What does it say? They don't suggest synthetic oil. So what?

Don't try to read between the lines, read the lines exactly - they do NOT say "do not use synthetic oil" or "the use of synthetic oil will damage your engine and void the warranty".

They also do not suggest anywhere using synthetic gear lube in the transmission or differential, so why don't we have a controversy over whether we should use synthetic gear oil? Just because Mazda doesn't suggest it, doesn't mean you can't do it. They DO require the use of API spec SL oil (that's not just a suggestion or "not suggested").

Until there's something official that actually means something, I'll stick with my API SL Castrol Syntec for my home oil changes.

So, anyone want to get into flash points and "burn temperature" discussions of 5W20 vs. 5W30, since both viscosities are recommended for the RX-8 depending on which continent you're on?

Regards,
Gordon

 

Hey,

If there was every a universal truth regarding rotary engines and discussion boards, it is that mentioning the words "synthetic oil" in any way is sure to cause just such a firestorm!

I was (am!) one of those doubters, but this was not directed at you. I am quite sure they did in fact send that to you. I just doubt that it means anything. or is in any way based on real information or experience with rotaries and synthetic oils.

Then again, I have an FD, which specifically does say in the manual to not use synthetics, and here I am with Royal Purple 10W30 in the motor, so go figure :D

jds

 

Just came back from Wal-Mart and I guess Mobil1 0W20 is the specified replacement for cars requiring 5W20. They advertised it that way saying it is the replacement oil for newer Hondas and Fords requiring 5W20. So take that for what it is.

On another note, I e-mailed Exxon/Mobil on their Mobil1 web site and asked for an engineer to answer some of the questions we've been debating on this thread. I'm interested on what their take is on this whole issue.

 

There seems to be a logic flaw in Mazda USA's response.

Have you guys asked yourselves the question :

"Why is lubricant injected into the combustion chamber of the rotary engine? To burn or to lubricate?"

Surely to lubricate! Sure all oils will burn but the more resistant to burn up the better. And when it burns the cleaner it burns the better. After I figured this out I went with HKS Super RE Rotary synthetic oil.

-Ringer-

 

FD owner laughs at this thread:D

You'll find people equally lined up on either side of this issue. www.racingbeat.com has been racing rotaries for longer that Pettit and they recommend Royal Purple synthetic. They are also trusted by Mazda to do the MazdaSpeed Protoge`. BTW I have no issues with my factory intercooler:p

FYI: My '93 runs Royal Purple 10w-30.