Vulcan1550

Southern California, Well in California in the 60's is cold. I have about 41400 miles on the car now and it is a Manual Transmission. Yes I had the plugs replaced at the 30,000 mile service. I have some hard starts when I first purchased the car but the second attempt always worked. Then I got my ecu flashed I think it was the M version and I was very happy. The car always started and got better mileage but I did notice it was warm by the gear box and cup holder. Then when I got my car back from the recall I notice the mileage was down and it was cooler at the gearbox area. The flooding was a complete shock to me, I had heard about it but never never experienced it before. The car totally refused to start in the garage. But I was carefull because I had a flashback that this could be a flood situation. I quickly got on the RX 8 site (here) and read about the procedures to cure the condition. The plugs are really buried in the car and I had no desire to get cut up trying to reach them. So I pulled the fuse and cranked the engine several times to dry out the plugs. One time it almost started ( with the fuel pump fuse pulled!!) that is how much gas and oil were in the chambers! It was a great relief to get the car started again. I will be much more carefull in the future. I have learned an important lesson!

shaunv74

I had a similar experience this weekend. I have 44K miles, original plugs, 6spd, have latest flash and all recalls done. It has been a week since I last started the car. I had driven the car home from work 40 miles on the highway and parked it in the garage all week. It's been cold but not below 35F. I went to start the car and it started turning over like it typically does and then the sound changed. it started to sound like the engine was spinning freely without the chugging sound the car normally makes when starting. I had it towed to the dealership today so I don't actually know that it has flooded but that is what I expect.

CERAMICSEAL

Please,
If possible, when describing your predicament, include what flash you are on and the year of the vehicle. I think as much info as possible is going to bring about resolution. Also, is yours on the original small battery and starter?

Vulcan1550

Hi thanks for the story. It sounds a lot my my story. My noise changed all of a sudden too. When the rotory engines start grinding you have this sick feeling of no compression and no way is this thing going to start. I was not willing to tow my car in so I pulled the fuel pump fuse and put my battery charger on the battery and kept cranking the engine with no fuel. A few times it wanted to fire and after about several hours of attempting to start and letting the battery rest, I kept at it and I finally got it to start. The car has been frustrating at best and now I am worried because I thought I only had to warm up the car when I moved it a short distance. Now it sounds like it could happen at any time! that is a scary thought because when the engine floods it is darn almost impossible to get it to start again. I hope they fix your car quickly. I cant believe some people try to flood their car! Once it floods it is tough times! Thanks!

shaunv74

The dealer fixed it and replaced the plugs, reflashed the computer. The car was flooded. They said they have been seeing it more often lately due to the weather change. I guess the colder weather is having an impact on the way the engine starts up. No problems since then and runs fine now. My advice is to make sure you let the engine warm up fully before shutting it down in colder weather and you should be fine. this is the first time it's happened to me since I've owned the car.

msrecant

This makes sense as both ambient temperature and battery condition appear to be factors associated with flooding. Particularly since this is now the start of the third winter season for many of the 2004 model year batteries, which were not all that great to begin with.

Vulcan1550

hi, I took my car in for A/C compressor replacement and I told the dealer about my flooding story and how I was able to re-start the car. The dealer told me that Mazda is now making a DVD that shows new owners of Rx-8 that when you start the car and old travel a short distance or if the motor is only on for a few minutes that you have to rev the car to 3000 rpm and hold it for at least 10 sec and then let it return to normal revs before you turn the car off. I did not have my plugs replaced since they were replaced at 30,000 miles. I hope I never have the car flood again. It is a horrible experience and I wish it on no one! Any body out there that tries to make is car flood to see if it is really true about the stories they hear is CRAZY!. Thanks for replying to my message!

msrecant

The "Product Update" DVD, the dealer was referencing, I believe has been going out to customers for about 9 months. Yes, it says for short trips let the car run until it reaches operating temp or for 5 minutes, then 3K for 10 sec, let got to idle and shut it off. The following post includes a page from the current owner's manual that says the same thing.

https://www.rx8club.com/showpost.php...&postcount=954

Bottom line, despite recent ECU/battery/starter improvements, Mazda is unable to provide an absolute technical "fix" and is using customer "education" to further reduce the incidents of flooding.

MEGAREDS

The "bottom bottom line" -- and please correct me if anyone knows otherwise -- is that Mazda NA is standing behind stranded motorists and treating all flooding episodes as warranty-covered incidents. As all the "old-timers" know by now, I was told in late 2003/early 2004 that it was my fault my car flooded, then that it would be covered just once as an "accomodation," then, eventually, and after much complaining, that Mazda would cover all floods under the warranty (non-intentional floods, anyway), even though they had an argument that flooding was due to "user error," and not any defect in workmanship or material. I think this has been their consistent policy. Am I right?

By the way, I expect you only need to do this once to not have any additional problems with it. As the prior poster has noted, it really, really sucks when it happens, and it's not likely that it will ever happen to me again. The key simply does not get turned to the off position without first looking at the temp gauge.

msrecant

I know (from this thread) a few people back then were told what you were told when their car flooded. I'm not sure that anyone is being told that now. The Mazda USA "Engine Cranks - No Start" TSB (http://www.finishlineperformance.com...4-05-1448b.pdf), which was published after that time frame, makes no reference to this being a one-time warranty repair. It seems like they are handling all floods as warranty issues.

Regardless, your point about warm-up is well taken because, eventually all our cars will be out of the warranty period.

MEGAREDS

You could always buy a Shinka, and put off the inevitable. I go to the Mazda dealer and look from time to time, just to dream about what I'll do after I win the lottery... I still love this car, even if the flooding and awful gas mileage make it less than perfect.

msrecant

Agreed!

It may have its flaws, but if you can accept it for what it is (or is not), it's an amazing car and a real source of driving pleasure.

FIRE CAP'N

My wife had a CEL issue. I went out later that evening to check the gas cap. It appeared tight. I started the car to see if the light was still on and it was. I shut it off, not knowing about flooding issues. The next morning I went out and tried to start it to go out and it would not. Tried the flood starting method and drained the battery three times(charging in between) No luck. Towed it to the shop.

Vulcan1550

Hi Fire Cap'n, Thanks for the reply. I live in southern California and it was a warm day that day. I guess I was lucky. I kept my 6amp charger on the battery at all times during my startup attempt. Pulling the fuse and repeatingly attempting to start the engine got the plugs to fire a few times. I actually inserted the fuse while the car was being cranked just in case the computer is programmed to inject extra fuel during the initial startup attempt. This way I bypassed that and inserted the fuse while cranking. I now observe the 5min warmup rule and go to 3000 rpm before I turn the car off. ( a real pain in the butt) I never want to have the car flood again. It is a real helpless feeling!

msrecant

Sorry to hear your experience. Tough way to learn about the flooding issue!

At least they can fix the CEL while its in the shop.

MEGAREDS

I really think it is enough to drive the car a few minutes; mine gets warm very quickly, even in fairly cold weather. I don't think it is wise to rev the car when it is not moving, given the recall.

I haven't done anything special since my flood in early Jan. '04, and it's been fine. I do worry about the battery as it gets weaker, though. I'm going to ask my dealer if he'd consider installing a new starter and the more powerful battery, but I know what he'll say since they made a big deal about including a "Battery Okay" sticker on my last service. There's still two years on my warranty and the car is much slower to start on cold days than it used to be -- I'll just say "I told you so" when the time comes, I suppose.

RX8 Pusher

OK, enough is enough....the 8 is in the garage and will not start for a second time. (All you folks who think it is my fault.....STFU!) Regardless of the looks, corning, etc...the car is going on the market this week. If I can not rely on the car each and every time I get in it then it is not worth it.

Go48

Yup, sell it! You shouldn't have bought it in the first place. If you're not willing to put up with a few quirks to own a unique vehicle, it's not the car for you. Get a Honda. Next time do a little research before you plunk your money down. Have a nice day!

RX8 Pusher

Hey Go48.....the simple fact that you own one tells me that I do not what the thing anymore...a few quirks? Bud I have two kids that may need to go to the hospital at some point in their lives and that car could be the only way I have to get them there. So take your sarcasm and crash yours head on into a tree!
My point is for a sticker of $36K I should not have to put up with ANY QUIRKS!

Brice-RX8

RX8 Pusher, what caused it to flood this time, what was the situation?

MEGAREDS

RX8Pusher:

Ask for the hotter spark plugs, the new battery and new starter. With those changes, and being careful, I suspect you won't have a problem. I'm also interested in why your car flooded in the garage, where the humidity should be lower than outside -- it is possible that you've got other issues, especially since you've got a manual, which seem less prone to flooding.

GO48: Your post is flamebait; you should delete it.

Go48

Perhaps, but my comments were not necessarily intended just for the original poster. Rather, they were intended to inform potential owners that this can be an issue they need to consider when thinking about purchasing a rotary-engined car. If I offended anyone, sorry for that. But if my comments inform prospective RX-8 owners about a potential negative associated with this car, then I will feel that I have made someone a more knowledgable buyer.

In fact, I just posted a new thread in the RX-8 Discussion section, "Don't buy an RX-8 if...", that is intended to do just that.

Brice-RX8

I think that Mazda has made it pretty clear that this car is different than any other, and there are few simple things that you can do to keep from having a flood occur. Yes, sometimes people forget and cut the car off too soon, and I hope that they don't get bitten buy this, but what can you do, they have told you about this possibility.

I for one back my car out of the garage for cleaning every week and keep it running until it is above the 2 lines for "C" and then do the 3k shut down and I have never experienced a flood. I also cut the car off like any other car when it is fully warmed up, pretty simple, just have to remember you have a different beast.

RX8 Pusher, not saying any of it is your fault but am curious as to what happened before the car flooded to maybe make it do this to you again.

CERAMICSEAL

F... the quirks! I'm one of the biggest rotary lovers out here. Mazda should dedicate crazy time to eliminating quirks. Make the rotary more like a piston engine while maintaining the qualities that make it a joy to own. It can be done.
And please people, give us specifics of your year, whether you've ever had plugs replaced, a battery replaced, an upgraded starter, whether you've had the latest computer flashes performed and how many miles you currently have.

msrecant

I absolutely agree!

This is a bug, not a feature. There has got to be a way to fix it, particularly with today's "smart" engines.