My RX-8 is nothing but problems!?!?!?!
05-19-2006, 10:00 AM
#51
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Originally Posted by zoom44
did you check your tranny fluid?
05-22-2006, 08:14 AM
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Originally Posted by Ryan13b
Marbles in a blender = detonation.
My car was doing the same thing, pinging, loss of power. Computer reflash didn't help. They just ordered me a motor today.
My car was doing the same thing, pinging, loss of power. Computer reflash didn't help. They just ordered me a motor today.
05-23-2006, 07:32 PM
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What kind of diagnosis was given to fully explain what caused the problems (i.e. power loss, pinging, etc.) which led to engine failure??
Driving pattern, outside temperature, prior flooding(s), inadequate oil cooling, or even Carbon build-up used as explanations?
Driving pattern, outside temperature, prior flooding(s), inadequate oil cooling, or even Carbon build-up used as explanations?
05-23-2006, 11:08 PM
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.... that's a pretty well detailed description of your situation and the diagnosis.. Now, the prognosis. Did anyone at Mazda give any recommendation or tips to avoid a 2nd or 3rd engine replacement?? If so, I wonder if they mirror much of the advice you see on the forums here.
P.S.: I'm assuming it's a reman engine you're getting?
P.S.: I'm assuming it's a reman engine you're getting?
05-24-2006, 02:21 PM
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Originally Posted by Ryan13b
Nobody at Mazda said what caused the problem. I don't think they're even convinced it's an engine problem, since they never did a compression test.
It sounds like they're out of ideas, but are replacing the engine to see if that fixes the problem.
It sounds like they're out of ideas, but are replacing the engine to see if that fixes the problem.
I was looking for any explanations given by Mazda officials when an engine is replaced.
05-25-2006, 05:20 PM
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As a multiple RX-7 owner for 20+ years, I am skeptical that a new motor would do anything. With a rotary motor, it is very very easy to see if the engine is bad. It will have low compression.
Does the car in question have low compression???
If not, it would be some other issue.
I also think it's interesting that the dealers are claiming to reflash the PCM by sending it out. Are the dealers not equipped to handle rotary motor PCMs??? Perhaps the dealers are claiming to send the computers out, when they are really getting rebuilt units instead. It only takes a laptop, and the correct software to reflash CAN based PCMs in the car. But not being an '8 owner perhaps there is something else. And just as a simple side note: the PCM controls the amount of oil being injected into the motor, so increased oil consumption would probably be from the PCM "seeing" a load on the motor if compression was fine.
Also replacing the motor sounds like what dealers used to do when working on the 3rd gen RX-7s. Most dealers didn't have a clue when there was something as simple as a bad sensor or leaking gasket.
As a rule RX-7 owners that have any sort of long term experience with a rotary powered car, never ever take the car to the dealer. Most dealer mechanics are just about as clueless as one can get. My own experience back in the late 80's with a Mazda dealer cements that.
Readers Digest abridged version:
I took my 87 RX-7 into the dealer, because the reverse light stopped working. Now mind that at that time I was working in the automotive electronics field and was a consultant between GM and a Tier 1 electronics supplier. So, I tested the switch myself before taking the car in. I only took the car in, because it was under warranty.
I told the dealer service advisor what the problem was, and asked him to fix it. He said he was putting his rotary specialist on it. 2 hours later he called telling me the problem was a bad battery (sound familiar???) and they wanted to sell me a battery. When I got there I asked to see the car and tech and asked how he figured this up. We walked up to the car and there is the tech in the car with the stereo blasting. He jumps out and says see it works with a battery charger. I look and the battery charger is set at 16 volts and sure enough the reverse lights worked. I told him that means nothing, as the car has a maximum voltage of 14.4 volts and batteries are 12.6 volts. All he did was burn the contacts clean by running above normal voltage in it.
The mechanic then said well and new battery would fix it. I took the car back and fixed the switch myself for $25 leaving the perfectly good battery in the car.
Moral of the story, get the shop manual and fix the car yourself and that dealership mechanics are clueless.
But if the car really needs a new motor, find out the compression first. If it is indeed low then perhaps a new motor would fix the issue. But if compression is above spec, then the same problem will re-appear no matter how many motors they put in.
And as a long term Rotary engine owner, I would be checking compression, alternator output, and PCM grounds as the first three things.
Does the car in question have low compression???
If not, it would be some other issue.
I also think it's interesting that the dealers are claiming to reflash the PCM by sending it out. Are the dealers not equipped to handle rotary motor PCMs??? Perhaps the dealers are claiming to send the computers out, when they are really getting rebuilt units instead. It only takes a laptop, and the correct software to reflash CAN based PCMs in the car. But not being an '8 owner perhaps there is something else. And just as a simple side note: the PCM controls the amount of oil being injected into the motor, so increased oil consumption would probably be from the PCM "seeing" a load on the motor if compression was fine.
Also replacing the motor sounds like what dealers used to do when working on the 3rd gen RX-7s. Most dealers didn't have a clue when there was something as simple as a bad sensor or leaking gasket.
As a rule RX-7 owners that have any sort of long term experience with a rotary powered car, never ever take the car to the dealer. Most dealer mechanics are just about as clueless as one can get. My own experience back in the late 80's with a Mazda dealer cements that.
Readers Digest abridged version:
I took my 87 RX-7 into the dealer, because the reverse light stopped working. Now mind that at that time I was working in the automotive electronics field and was a consultant between GM and a Tier 1 electronics supplier. So, I tested the switch myself before taking the car in. I only took the car in, because it was under warranty.
I told the dealer service advisor what the problem was, and asked him to fix it. He said he was putting his rotary specialist on it. 2 hours later he called telling me the problem was a bad battery (sound familiar???) and they wanted to sell me a battery. When I got there I asked to see the car and tech and asked how he figured this up. We walked up to the car and there is the tech in the car with the stereo blasting. He jumps out and says see it works with a battery charger. I look and the battery charger is set at 16 volts and sure enough the reverse lights worked. I told him that means nothing, as the car has a maximum voltage of 14.4 volts and batteries are 12.6 volts. All he did was burn the contacts clean by running above normal voltage in it.
The mechanic then said well and new battery would fix it. I took the car back and fixed the switch myself for $25 leaving the perfectly good battery in the car.
Moral of the story, get the shop manual and fix the car yourself and that dealership mechanics are clueless.
But if the car really needs a new motor, find out the compression first. If it is indeed low then perhaps a new motor would fix the issue. But if compression is above spec, then the same problem will re-appear no matter how many motors they put in.
And as a long term Rotary engine owner, I would be checking compression, alternator output, and PCM grounds as the first three things.
06-05-2006, 07:38 PM
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Update
Hello all,
I have been monitoring the car over the past two weeks. Tonight I finally had enough.
Over the past two weeks I have noticed the detonation issue several times and also after long commutes on the beltway the car while resting at zero mph would dip below 500 RPM in which the back of the car would shake and also there would be the loud clacking noise from under the car.
Tonight I was on the way home from the gym and drove the car normally I didn't break 70 on the highway and didn't have any quick stops. Well about 5 miles from my house I slow down to a stoplight and boom...the car goes to 0 RPM and shuts off
. I turn the car off and turn it back on and again the car struggles to come back on. I continue on my way home and about 1 mile away from my house I stop again at a light and it happens again - the car shuts off.
When I get to work tomorrow I am going into one of the conference rooms at my office and get on the phone and chew out MONA. Enough is enough.
I have been monitoring the car over the past two weeks. Tonight I finally had enough.
Over the past two weeks I have noticed the detonation issue several times and also after long commutes on the beltway the car while resting at zero mph would dip below 500 RPM in which the back of the car would shake and also there would be the loud clacking noise from under the car.
Tonight I was on the way home from the gym and drove the car normally I didn't break 70 on the highway and didn't have any quick stops. Well about 5 miles from my house I slow down to a stoplight and boom...the car goes to 0 RPM and shuts off
. I turn the car off and turn it back on and again the car struggles to come back on. I continue on my way home and about 1 mile away from my house I stop again at a light and it happens again - the car shuts off. When I get to work tomorrow I am going into one of the conference rooms at my office and get on the phone and chew out MONA. Enough is enough.
06-05-2006, 08:31 PM
#59
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Originally Posted by Icemark
As a multiple RX-7 owner for 20+ years, I am skeptical that a new motor would do anything. With a rotary motor, it is very very easy to see if the engine is bad. It will have low compression.
Does the car in question have low compression???
If not, it would be some other issue.
I also think it's interesting that the dealers are claiming to reflash the PCM by sending it out. Are the dealers not equipped to handle rotary motor PCMs??? Perhaps the dealers are claiming to send the computers out, when they are really getting rebuilt units instead. It only takes a laptop, and the correct software to reflash CAN based PCMs in the car. But not being an '8 owner perhaps there is something else. And just as a simple side note: the PCM controls the amount of oil being injected into the motor, so increased oil consumption would probably be from the PCM "seeing" a load on the motor if compression was fine.
Does the car in question have low compression???
If not, it would be some other issue.
I also think it's interesting that the dealers are claiming to reflash the PCM by sending it out. Are the dealers not equipped to handle rotary motor PCMs??? Perhaps the dealers are claiming to send the computers out, when they are really getting rebuilt units instead. It only takes a laptop, and the correct software to reflash CAN based PCMs in the car. But not being an '8 owner perhaps there is something else. And just as a simple side note: the PCM controls the amount of oil being injected into the motor, so increased oil consumption would probably be from the PCM "seeing" a load on the motor if compression was fine.
a. if the car in question is experience the symptoms that are associated with this problem and the pcm change doesnt remedy the situation then MNAO tells the dealer to replace the engine. even if its before the compression is out of spec. becasue they will lose it.
b. the pcm is sent to MNAO because it cannot be changed in the field. the same pcm goes back into the car with a different MOP profile then it had before. there are reasons it cant be done by the dealers - one being it isnt in the system for them to do it.
search my posts for info abot the pcm change adn the at stalling /dying/ engine replacement issue.
06-05-2006, 10:02 PM
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Originally Posted by RedRotaryRx8
Hello all,
I have been monitoring the car over the past two weeks. Tonight I finally had enough.
Over the past two weeks I have noticed the detonation issue several times and also after long commutes on the beltway the car while resting at zero mph would dip below 500 RPM in which the back of the car would shake and also there would be the loud clacking noise from under the car.
Tonight I was on the way home from the gym and drove the car normally I didn't break 70 on the highway and didn't have any quick stops. Well about 5 miles from my house I slow down to a stoplight and boom...the car goes to 0 RPM and shuts off. I turn the car off and turn it back on and again the car struggles to come back on. I continue on my way home and about 1 mile away from my house I stop again at a light and it happens again - the car shuts off.
When I get to work tomorrow I am going into one of the conference rooms at my office and get on the phone and chew out MONA. Enough is enough.
I have been monitoring the car over the past two weeks. Tonight I finally had enough.
Over the past two weeks I have noticed the detonation issue several times and also after long commutes on the beltway the car while resting at zero mph would dip below 500 RPM in which the back of the car would shake and also there would be the loud clacking noise from under the car.
Tonight I was on the way home from the gym and drove the car normally I didn't break 70 on the highway and didn't have any quick stops. Well about 5 miles from my house I slow down to a stoplight and boom...the car goes to 0 RPM and shuts off
. I turn the car off and turn it back on and again the car struggles to come back on. I continue on my way home and about 1 mile away from my house I stop again at a light and it happens again - the car shuts off. When I get to work tomorrow I am going into one of the conference rooms at my office and get on the phone and chew out MONA. Enough is enough.
06-06-2006, 08:27 AM
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The same exact problems are happening with my automatic transmission rx8. I am on here trying to get advise. Mazda is NO help. They built the freaking car, but they can't fix it. Hmmmm. They say they can't get it to drive badly when they drive it. Oh well, I am stalling out in the middle of intersections. That is the problem, fix it. I HATE my rx8 and hope to sell that piece soon. It is such a pretty car to be such a waste with performance.
06-06-2006, 08:55 AM
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Yeah, me too. I wrote a letter to Mazda, they called back and now I am working on trying to get them to buy it back or offer some sort of relief. Mine has been in the shop 5 times since I bought it. I'll keep you posted.
06-06-2006, 08:58 AM
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Called Mazda this morning
I called Mazda today and added another complaint to my log. I told the customer service rep that it stalled again and that sending the PCM out to CA did nothing to fix the problem.
I also told him I was a member of this forum and saw the problem was widespread and that I knew the next step was an engine replacement. I also said it is ridiculous that I have a car with 30,000 miles on it and have to worry about it stalling all the time.
He said he would pass the information along to my dealership and also to the district rep in the area.
So it looks like I will be the newest member of the new engine club.
I also told him I was a member of this forum and saw the problem was widespread and that I knew the next step was an engine replacement. I also said it is ridiculous that I have a car with 30,000 miles on it and have to worry about it stalling all the time.
He said he would pass the information along to my dealership and also to the district rep in the area.
So it looks like I will be the newest member of the new engine club.
06-06-2006, 09:18 AM
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Originally Posted by RedRotaryRx8
I called Mazda today and added another complaint to my log. I told the customer service rep that it stalled again and that sending the PCM out to CA did nothing to fix the problem.
I also told him I was a member of this forum and saw the problem was widespread and that I knew the next step was an engine replacement. I also said it is ridiculous that I have a car with 30,000 miles on it and have to worry about it stalling all the time.
He said he would pass the information along to my dealership and also to the district rep in the area.
So it looks like I will be the newest member of the new engine club.
I also told him I was a member of this forum and saw the problem was widespread and that I knew the next step was an engine replacement. I also said it is ridiculous that I have a car with 30,000 miles on it and have to worry about it stalling all the time.
He said he would pass the information along to my dealership and also to the district rep in the area.
So it looks like I will be the newest member of the new engine club.
Installing a new engine without the old one having problems (i.e. low compression) will do NOTHING to solve your problem. Simply because your problem lies elsewhere.
Check Compression. A simple task that takes about 15'. Do this first. Every dealer has the compression tester, and can do this if they are qualified RX8 technicians. If you are low on compression, then by all means continue with the new engine swap. If not, search for other causes, like cat, AT gearbox, idle setting, maybe a vacuum hose being loose, that sort of things....
06-06-2006, 09:30 AM
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Originally Posted by The Ace
So far, I have seen neither you nor ANY of the dealers doing the simple thing of checking compression. Like Icemark said, and according to my own experience (as a previous RX7 owner), a bad engine means low compression and vice versa (well, maybe also bad oil or water seals).
Installing a new engine without the old one having problems (i.e. low compression) will do NOTHING to solve your problem. Simply because your problem lies elsewhere.
Check Compression. A simple task that takes about 15'. Do this first. Every dealer has the compression tester, and can do this if they are qualified RX8 technicians. If you are low on compression, then by all means continue with the new engine swap. If not, search for other causes, like cat, AT gearbox, idle setting, maybe a vacuum hose being loose, that sort of things....
Installing a new engine without the old one having problems (i.e. low compression) will do NOTHING to solve your problem. Simply because your problem lies elsewhere.
Check Compression. A simple task that takes about 15'. Do this first. Every dealer has the compression tester, and can do this if they are qualified RX8 technicians. If you are low on compression, then by all means continue with the new engine swap. If not, search for other causes, like cat, AT gearbox, idle setting, maybe a vacuum hose being loose, that sort of things....
https://www.rx8club.com/showthread.p...engine+replace
You will see the post from okstatepike (who had the exact same issue as me) mention Mazda/his dealership tell him there is a low compression issue with the engine. Mazda is aware of the low compression issue.
06-06-2006, 09:31 AM
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Lemon Law???
Sorry to hear about your problems, it just isn't right!
I'm lucky enough to have a somewhat decent dealership (40miles away) - at least the master mechanic is decent.
Back in early 2004 my car's cel came on. Brought it into the dealership and they "fixed" the problem, the code was "evaporative leak" - like the gas cap wasn't tight. Three days later the cel came on - I went back to the dealership, this happened three times - The fourth time, I threatened to Lemon Law the car, and I was told to go to a specific dealership, they found the problem, a bad sensor located somewhere above the gas tank.
The Lemon Law (at least in Florida) is a powerful tool, hopefully you could use that to leverage a fix from Mazda or a new car (you pay the difference in mileage).
Good luck,
Alex
I'm lucky enough to have a somewhat decent dealership (40miles away) - at least the master mechanic is decent.
Back in early 2004 my car's cel came on. Brought it into the dealership and they "fixed" the problem, the code was "evaporative leak" - like the gas cap wasn't tight. Three days later the cel came on - I went back to the dealership, this happened three times - The fourth time, I threatened to Lemon Law the car, and I was told to go to a specific dealership, they found the problem, a bad sensor located somewhere above the gas tank.
The Lemon Law (at least in Florida) is a powerful tool, hopefully you could use that to leverage a fix from Mazda or a new car (you pay the difference in mileage).
Good luck,
Alex
06-06-2006, 09:32 AM
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I am headed to the Mazda place again today and talking to the service manager. I am bringing copies of this thread. I don't understand having an unreliable car. I hope I don't get into a wreck and hurt bc my Automatic trans car stalled out in the middle of an intersection. This scares me.
06-06-2006, 09:38 AM
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Originally Posted by swiftnet
Sorry to hear about your problems, it just isn't right!
I'm lucky enough to have a somewhat decent dealership (40miles away) - at least the master mechanic is decent.
Back in early 2004 my car's cel came on. Brought it into the dealership and they "fixed" the problem, the code was "evaporative leak" - like the gas cap wasn't tight. Three days later the cel came on - I went back to the dealership, this happened three times - The fourth time, I threatened to Lemon Law the car, and I was told to go to a specific dealership, they found the problem, a bad sensor located somewhere above the gas tank.
The Lemon Law (at least in Florida) is a powerful tool, hopefully you could use that to leverage a fix from Mazda or a new car (you pay the difference in mileage).
Good luck,
Alex
I'm lucky enough to have a somewhat decent dealership (40miles away) - at least the master mechanic is decent.
Back in early 2004 my car's cel came on. Brought it into the dealership and they "fixed" the problem, the code was "evaporative leak" - like the gas cap wasn't tight. Three days later the cel came on - I went back to the dealership, this happened three times - The fourth time, I threatened to Lemon Law the car, and I was told to go to a specific dealership, they found the problem, a bad sensor located somewhere above the gas tank.
The Lemon Law (at least in Florida) is a powerful tool, hopefully you could use that to leverage a fix from Mazda or a new car (you pay the difference in mileage).
Good luck,
Alex
I am over on both so the Lemon Law won't help me here.
06-06-2006, 09:46 AM
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Originally Posted by RedRotaryRx8
If you go to this thread:
https://www.rx8club.com/showthread.p...engine+replace
You will see the post from okstatepike (who had the exact same issue as me) mention Mazda/his dealership tell him there is a low compression issue with the engine. Mazda is aware of the low compression issue.
https://www.rx8club.com/showthread.p...engine+replace
You will see the post from okstatepike (who had the exact same issue as me) mention Mazda/his dealership tell him there is a low compression issue with the engine. Mazda is aware of the low compression issue.
How is it possible that all ATs have low compression ? Is it a manufacturing problem ? Because it has nothing to do with the transmission itself. I repeat: the compression of an engine has nothing to do with the transmission attached to it.
In any case, they are willing to give you a new engine based on a guess for ALL ATs currently rolling their wheels in the US ?
Amazing.....So, instead of actually doing the compression test to see the compression of your own engine, they are willing to swap it based on observations made on other cars ? Even more amazing.....
Unless, like I said in the begining, ALL ATs received bad engines from the factory, in which case a total recall should be announced, since this could become dangerous for many drivers driving ATs out there....
In any case, I would insist that the dealer performs a compression test on my car....
....amazing.....
06-06-2006, 11:20 AM
#72
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its not ALL. so far its about 200 mostly in 3 areas. with a few spread around. please read my post earlier in this thread and other posts by concerning at/ engine reolascement/ lubbock/ las vegas etc.
06-06-2006, 12:40 PM
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Originally Posted by zoom44
its not ALL. so far its about 200 mostly in 3 areas. with a few spread around. please read my post earlier in this thread and other posts by concerning at/ engine reolascement/ lubbock/ las vegas etc.
Anyone in CA have problems? Guess I'll be keeping track of this thread!
06-15-2006, 09:37 AM
#74
I own a ‘04 AT in the semi-tropical heat swamp of Houston. It now has 30,000 mi, and is running great. It has gone in for the gas tank heat shield, ECU flash, and new motor mounts.
This board has some knowledgeable people posting on it. Read the posts from Zoom44, Rotary God, and other rotary experts. Do what they recommend. This car is not an appliance, owner involvement is necessary for long service life.
The single most important service issue for the rotary is frequent oil changes. You only get out half the old oil, so change it at twice the recommended intervals for schedule 2. I use 2-2.5 K mi. as my change interval.
The rotary is a hot little engine, and is partially cooled by oil. The oil coolers are very important. I had one lost power episode on a long drive at 90 F, and looked at my oil cooler when I got home. Half of the fins were bent. As we AT owners have only one cooler, this means my oil cooling ability was at only 50%. I straightened the fins, and bought a oil cooler shield screen soon after. No more lost power events on long drives. Extended idling in rush hour traffic, with no air moving over the oil cooler, will also result in lost power. To that end, I have installed an oil cooler fan. This has eliminated the problem in stopped traffic so far (4 mo.).
This board has some knowledgeable people posting on it. Read the posts from Zoom44, Rotary God, and other rotary experts. Do what they recommend. This car is not an appliance, owner involvement is necessary for long service life.
The single most important service issue for the rotary is frequent oil changes. You only get out half the old oil, so change it at twice the recommended intervals for schedule 2. I use 2-2.5 K mi. as my change interval.
The rotary is a hot little engine, and is partially cooled by oil. The oil coolers are very important. I had one lost power episode on a long drive at 90 F, and looked at my oil cooler when I got home. Half of the fins were bent. As we AT owners have only one cooler, this means my oil cooling ability was at only 50%. I straightened the fins, and bought a oil cooler shield screen soon after. No more lost power events on long drives. Extended idling in rush hour traffic, with no air moving over the oil cooler, will also result in lost power. To that end, I have installed an oil cooler fan. This has eliminated the problem in stopped traffic so far (4 mo.).
06-21-2006, 07:54 PM
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See my new post from erjjet. pwr loss/pinging/rough idle/stalling. If you need to talk in detail just email me and we can talk over the phone by exchanging numbers. I've gone crazy for 4 months and the dealer made me think I was nuts. Your car has a problem. It is temp related. Mine is finally getting a new engine.
Hope to talk to you soon. I would like to help you as much as I can. It's not fair to buy a car for so much money and have all these problems.
Hope to talk to you soon. I would like to help you as much as I can. It's not fair to buy a car for so much money and have all these problems.