sandnsun7

relocated my battery to the windshied washer tank spot, have had starting problems ever since.

checked all my grounds and connections, tight. did the clear nvram, no improvement. check the connections to the ESS. did not disconnect the connector but was on good.

cleaned the MAF.

have gotten the occasional CEL when it does take a while to start, checked the code and it says it is the ESS? Eccentric shaft sensor.

The pulley/cogged wheel is in good condition, no bends. and i checked that there is a gap between it and the ESS. ESS is clean too.

Does the starter have to turn the motor over at a certain rpm to get the ignition at the coils as triggered by the ESS?

Even with a charger and a freshly charged red top optima, my car won't start right up.

The car will crank over for about 5 seconds, i turn the key off and try again, it usually starts, but 5x out of 10 it sometimes takes several cranks to get it to start.

I tried the following as well.

i pulled off the leading coil plug wire a bit at the coil closest too me from the front of the motor, just enough to see spark jump and noticed that it was not sparking while cranking, and when it did spark, it would start!!! ?????

i tried to check the ESS by flashing; key switch in the all way forward position, i would get the fuel relay and circuit relay click, but no spark, then ever once in a while i would get a spark.

did this on both the leading and trailing coil plug wire. i flashed the ess with a feeler gauge and could hear the clicking of the relays but no spark.

is there any way to check the ESS? i noticed on the wiring diagram it goes directly to the PCM.

no relay or anything.

the car starts, but it has to crank over alot. once it starts, it runs fine.

it is the getting there that sucks.

any help would be greatly appreciated. i have searched the threads until my head started to spin

Thanks

Tom

Jon316G

iTrader: (1)

How many miles are on the car?
When was the last time you changed out the coils?
Have you cleaned the ESS for any metal shavings?
Have you measured the resistance across the two terminals?

sandnsun7

2004 MT, 32k miles.
havent changed the coils, ever.
wiped off the ESS didnt see any shavings. will check again.
have not measured the resistance across the two terminals. what should it read?

Thanks,

Jon316G

iTrader: (1)

950 - 1250 ohms

You might want to consider coils too. Especially if you have intermittent sparks.
Have you checked the spark on all the plugs?
If some sparks appear to be better than others, its probably a coil or two.
If all the coils generate a low spark, then its probably something else (unless all four coils are going bad).

sandnsun7

found this old post reply of yours:

I can kinda see it...
The starter turns the flywheel which is connected to the eccentric shaft.
So if the starter is too weak, which lessens the rotations, and the E-shaft positioning sensor doesn't read enough pulses within its tolerance, it 'should' throw a code.
Never heard of it before, but I can visualize it.

thinkg this could be my problem?

does the ESS have to see quick revolutions from the tone wheel to give a spark signal to the coils?

me flashing a feeler gauge over the switch would make it click in the relay section, but only give a spark once in a while.

hope im not making this more complicated than it is by trying to check the ESS out.

my connection ground under the battery box is good as well. took teknics advice and checked that connection too.


__________________

sandnsun7

when it starts, it runs fine. wouldnt the coils cause problems during running if they had intermittent problems?

the car runs great once it is started. no issues with idling or accelleration. only starting and when i do see a spark on my test mentioned in the first of the post, it looks pretty strong.

Jon316G

iTrader: (1)

You also have another variable that you should consider first... and that's your battery relocation.
You mentioned that this started after relocating the battery.
Can you wire it back like it was (stock) and see if you still have the same issues?

sandnsun7

tried that, no change. installed another battery to check the old battery, even hooked it up to a charger to give it a little boost.

still spins, no change in starting.

wired everything back the way it was.

Jon316G

iTrader: (1)

When you crank it, does the starting appear "strong" or does it sound weak?
Meaning... does the cranking sound start to die/slow down right away?

Here is a video I made showing a bad starter and new one:
http://www.vimeo.com/3653485
You can tell a difference between the two.

sandnsun7

Man that is exactly how mine sounds! just like the first one, OE starter and battery, i have the optima red top, and it sounds just like the second one when it starts on a good day.

i think you may be on to something. i have the battery. now must get the starter.

where did you get your starter. i hear there are a lot of different opinions on which one to get. dont get a rebuild, dont get a delco. etc.

where did you get that starter in the video?

Thanks
Tom

Jon316G

iTrader: (1)

PM MazMart.
He is a forum vendor.

Danijalvt

I have the same problem on my 8!!! But here is the wired thing with my 8 it is a 2004 manual GT 35000miles. I had idle issues at a stop light that was making mine exhaust rattle and it was getting on my nerves. The car was starting like a dream with the coils that had burn marks on them and with the old spark plugs and old wires. Now comes the wired part I got the BHR ignition installed with new wires new sparkplugs, Now the car needs to be cranked at least 5 times before it starts. When the car starts it runns great no idle issues very strong and smooth. I don't have a clue what could be causing my problem besides coils or wires but tested it over 200miles with no missfires and no problems besides the starting issue. Any help anybody has i would apprichiate.

Razz1

You put new coils in but didn't check the spark plugs?

Danijalvt

What do you mean I didn't check the spark plugs? As it said in my previous post I put new coils bhr ignition new wires new spark plugs. Before I did the change the only shymphtom I had was bad idle only when stoped. Now I have starting issues I need to crank at least 5 times before it starts. It seems that the coils get the signal to spark late! I want to try to fix this weekend but need some help where to look and what could be the problem. Also the only thing I gave not put into my first post is that I have not adjusted the dwell setting for this coils but I was told that dwell would not give me delayed stats. Any help I will be thankfull for.

m3pkrobert

iTrader: (1)

I been having this exact problem lately, I took the car to the dealer and they changed the ESS that didnt fix anything, so I change the starter (I got it from autozone)and the car was fine for 3 months between that time I change the spark plugs and coils, but than the problem came back, so I though maybe is the battery, so I went to autoparts and change it for a new yellow top but still, I dont know what else to do :S

ASH8

From memory ALL the 2004-5's had starters which will go slow in time (30K miles), the upgrade was the Starter and Battery, the originals had a 50 AMP hour rating, so overnight if you are running an Immobilizer and or Alarm the battery becomes weak.

In 2006 Mazda went to a 75 AMP Hour Battery...2009's have an 80 AMP Hour.

Get your modified Starter from Paul, Mazmart, he sells the genuine Mazda (mitsubishi) one.
And make sure your new battery is at least a 75-80 AMP Hour Rated one.

To put it another way if your Alarm is using about 2 Amps per hour (average), in a 10-12 hour overnighter it has used 24 AMPS of original 50
AMP hour Battery, so you Battery is half flat when you start it in the morning...and that is with a Battery that is in "new" condition.

sandnsun7

UPDATE: bought a new starter, installed it, started right up. spins fast, sounds great. starts just fine.
Thanks for all the help guys. still wondering how that ESS works, must have to see a certain rpm to get the proper flash to make the coils hit.

or maybe the ESS is going out. i noticed that from time to time, i get a waiver in the idle. like it hiccups while idling!

ASH8

GREAT TO HEAR!!!...

The odd idle hiccup is normal...well sort off, when my car was Brand new it never did it, and now I get the odd few.

It is more Ignition related/Spark, I am thinking spark plug condition.

The Crank Sensor is over 10 years old and also used in other Mazda's, Even Their Piston Engines of the 1990's, FD RX-7,323,626,MPV., So from what I know it is reliable.

kingrx8paulo

Please see that someone can help me know what q q is wrong with my rx8 try several times does not turn on and no lights were aogado seems like q or not this is the battery and see the lights illuminate q under carefully paulo